World Views and Politics

Leading religious institutes agree – warsong




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A news article said
"Leading religious institutes like the Presbyterian, Episcopalian, Church of Christ, as well as high Church officials in the Greek Orthodox, Catholic, and Protestant Church have forcefully criticized Israelís human rights record and have supported various types of boycotts."
Not including but also other religions like the Muslim, Asian, etc.

"Major trade unions in Canada, South Africa, and in the European Union and Middle East have expressed opposition to Israeli ethnic cleansing and militarism. University teachers, led by British and Irish educators, are supporting a boycott of Israeli scholars and institutes collaborating with the Israeli regime. Even within the United States, despite the Lobbyís propaganda campaigns, a majority of US citizens did not support Israelís bombing of Lebanon"
For the US news to complain about Muslim countries being run by government is kind of hypocritical when the same is done here and many political news reporters off the record agree that it's hypocritical since they are restricted as well and can only say certain things to cater to one side and not the entire story so people know whatís going on. This is why some go with international news than US news.


Go Figure how the main heads and history know whatís going on but many of the people that follow them help people that try to hurt them.

What do you call when the civilian deaths vastly outnumber the soldierís deaths?
It's a slaughter or genocide.

What do you call it when $10billion of civilian homes, businesses, and infrastructure gets destroyed more than military arsenal?
War crimes that violate the Geneva Conventions and the protocols of the Nuremberg Tribunal.

What do you call that the rules and propaganda applies to others but not to specific people that are above the law that do break the rules the most and have power to manipulate the news that the majority of the world has seem the crimes committed are mainly by the ones that are immune?
Something fishy and unchristian.

What do you call people that believe what they are fed?
Maybe dogs since dogs are told what to eat and do.

Just like the last post about what are you a republican or democrat about if a crazy person is coming at you to kill you what do you do. Now the one to blame is not the crazy person if the guy doesnít protect his family but the guy that lets the crazy person hurt his family since they are more insane than the crazy person.

The odd thing is that I use to say over 5-10 years ago that the Muslim religion is not good but people didnít believe it and now many do but are misunderstanding it as well. Maybe it might take another 5-10 years for people to get it since as bad as the religion is; it is not the cause of the world's problems. We are the cause for not understanding what is going on to support the wrong things which hurts us and everyone else. We can not blame the wolf for it trying to hunt your sheep; you are to blame for not doing your job to take care of the sheep and not knowing what is going on.

People that find politics boring are boring since if they can not care for something that impacts them and only care for useless things, and then what does that tell you about the person?

Obviously some that know less will argue just because they donít want to be woken up from their state of delusion since ignorance is bliss as the saying goes.

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"The conversion of a savage to Christianity is the conversion of Christianity to savagery." George Bernard Shaw (Hence christian sects)"Hell is paved with good intentions, not with bad ones"
"Matthew 7 21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;... depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
Orthodoxy=best kept secret in the US. 2nd largest Christian communion in the world




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This one is a mix of the 2 post about the pope in his comments and this. Also the fact the some forums have an error and doesn't let you reply.

"The most senior Palestinian churchman, Archbishop Theodosius Atallah Hanna of Sebaste called upon Muslims to show their magnanimity and put an end to their campaign against the Pope. ďThe Pope apologised for his unfortunate words; now it is time to put this affair behind us and forget itĒ said the Msgr. Theodosius, a leading Palestinian cleric of the Orthodox Church of Jerusalem and the Holy Land, well known for his active support of the Palestinian cause. He spoke at the Church of Mar Elias (Elijah the Prophet) in his native Haifa to local Christians and Muslims. ďDespite long and troubled history of our Church relationship with the Catholic ChurchĒ Ė said Atallah Hanna in a veiled reference to the Catholic Crusade against Orthodox Christians, - ďI call for friendly, warm and brotherly relations with Vatican, and with all Christian and Muslim believersĒ.

Archbishop joined with the Muslim clerics condemning a wave of arson targeting Catholic churches in Palestine. The perpetrators of these crimes are still unknown, and the Haaretz newspaper reported that Israeli Security Services [Shabak] are widely suspected for being behind it. The Orthodox Church is the oldest and biggest Christian Church in the Holy Land."
Pope
Israel behind church burnings?
Orthodox church helping catholic?
Orthodox getting along the best with other religions?
so it seem

[This message has been edited by warsong (edited October 03, 2006).]

Lazarus

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quote:

What do you call when the civilian deaths vastly outnumber the soldierís deaths?
It's a slaughter or genocide.


I'd call it someone waging a smart war.
Just gotta say, if you want a war to end you hit the civilians. That's the way it has always been. From way back in the Bible to WWII.

Oh, and a lot of that anti-Israeli stuff, it sounds like propoganda to me.

ďDespite long and troubled history of our Church relationship with the Catholic ChurchĒ

That's the understatement of the century. How about:
"Despite long and violent, brutal, bloody history of our Church relationship with the Catholic Church."

And I'll end on this note. I'm only 15, what do I know about politics? This is just my opinion, wrong though it may well be. I don't think there always is a right and wrong side.

Lazarus

Faith_Warrior

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Posts: 490
From: So.Cal.
Registered: 09-05-2006
quote:
Originally posted by warsong:
A news article said
"Leading religious institutes like...

Ugh, what will they think of next??

As for the Pope, he had it right the first time. He said it but there it is. So does the reaction prove that it's a religion of peace? Or to the contrary as stated?

I guess every dog has its day.

Lastly... "Go Israel!!!" :thumbsup:





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These kinds of replies seem sorry to say a bit unchristian and once people slip away from Christís teaching they will get influenced in the bad way. As Christ said he is the Alpha and the Omega, you know the first and the last but to side with non christian views is contradicting christ since he can be first but not in the way he said it or the way we want it.

Laz===
Thatís not a way and is against all the rules stated which many countries have been in trouble for doing that and the majority of Christians and people all over the world agree. That canít be a smart war when their will be more hostility are cause more problems. Put yourself in their positions and ask yourself what if your mother, father, family and friend got killed or became crippled because some nut wants to attack you just to make sure you are not the bad guy. And with Muslim they believe and eye for an eye just like the Israel and they will just get revenge.
Even Serbiaís churches have been burned down during the war and the civilian infrastructure has been destroyed and more people died and Ĺ of the US and the entire world gets that it was a BS war. You donít kill civilians to win a war if that was the case then Hitler was waging a smart war since he killed civilians.
Itís not anti Israeli itís what going on. What next anti black news when you hear that blacks were destroying thing when Katerina hit, or the LA riots. Letís look at it logically and not cater or favor any side.

As for the understatement they donít bother emphasizing since they donít want to stir up anything I would guess in what the Catholics have done to them. Or I guess they are going with what the bible says to forgive.

If there is no right and wrong side then why not become Muslim since there is no right and wrong side. Lol

Faith warrior===
I agree he said it right the first time but I guess he wanted to show that people should forgive just like the bible says. But not to forget or not know which many Christians in the USA seem to do that since they ignore history and the facts and attack which is the opposite of Christianity.

Go Israel? Maybe you should live their and then you will appreciate sin city LA as a moral place. Lol Donít judge on your high chair, while not counting the majority of people and countries that have experience in dealing with the Middle East for millenniums, unlike the US which is still and infant and gullible with its altered form of Christianity which has been slowly been rotten away with politically correctness is not helping. Just donít take things at face value and treat every side equally fair and to say go Israel is ignorant and humble in your analogy.

Even Socrates being considered the greatest mind of all time said that the thing he is certain about is that he knows nothing. People learn every day and sometimes they learn things that change their entire view but they have to be humble enough to understand it all.

Good luck.

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"The conversion of a savage to Christianity is the conversion of Christianity to savagery." George Bernard Shaw (Hence christian sects)"Hell is paved with good intentions, not with bad ones"
"Matthew 7 21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;... depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
Orthodoxy=best kept secret in the US. 2nd largest Christian communion in the world

Lazarus

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quote:

You donít kill civilians to win a war if that was the case then Hitler was waging a smart war since he killed civilians.

Look at the bombings of Dresden and other german cities during WWII.
The Allies pounded those places, which were not sites of enemy Soldiers or factories. Thousands of civilians died in the bombings and the firestorms that sometimes followed.

Some might ask whether it is unchristian even to fight, btw.
Anyway I wasn't justifying Israel or Hezbollah's actions(but I'm not condemning them either).
I was simply rebutting your assertion that large numbers of dead civilians means genocide.

Look: Hezbollah attacked Israel. According to everything I've heard most of the Lebanese were pro-Hezbollah and supported them.
If you take that as true, I see no reason why the Israeli's shouldn't have done what they did.

My Dad said something that I sure wish would happen a few weeks ago. He said that if one or the other side would simply stop fighting, and forgive, the conflict would end.
There's so much hate over there, and has been for thousands of years. It's really sad.

Warsong, I didn't say there is no right or wrong side, I said I don't think there always is.
You seem to be passing over Hezbollah's actions. How many Israeli civilians were murdered by the rocket attacks?

Oh, and about the Pope, it sounded to me like he was backing down, because he was afraid of the Muslims.
True, many Israeli's don't follow God, and maybe God is punishing them or something. It's not for me to say.

My own opinions can change from day to day so there's no guarantee I'm right.

"If you do not forgive all men, then your heavenly Father cannot forgive you", paraphrasing.

Lazarus

Faith_Warrior

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So Iím ignorant becauseÖ I disagree with your viewsÖ yes so obviously Iím ignorant. So since Iím ignorant and support Israel I should just move there? I really hate it when conversations such as this degrade and especially so quickly. This is actually an typical attack that has been repeated so many times but with nothing good coming of it.

Actually moving to Israel is an inviting prospect, but I feel called to stay in my own country that supports Israel (one of like two countries in this evil world) and help as best I can to stem the tide of the terrible delusion that many in my country want to steer our path onto. If all us who support Israel and their fight against Terrorism were to leave this country, I do believe that Godís direct blessings upon this country for supporting Israel would be swiftly removed and this country would implode upon itself, itĎs just the only thing propping my country up. This nation would turn into a purely Marxist nation, and that which remnants of Christianity here under the authority of such a government would be those that do such things as openly support the ordination of homosexual clergy into their ďleading religious institutesĒ.

So no, it really has no bearing on my views regarding what they may dream up next. Iím not required to support their views or assimilate into their agendas. I can choose ďtheir sideĒ or someone elseís side. Do I follow people or do I follow God? I think thatís what it comes down to. God gave each of us the capacity to use reason and follow his instruction which is pretty well defined in the inspired and literal bible which is the word of God. But leading religious institutions often seem to disagree with this position. If they are the many and I am among the few than I feel no alarm I assure you, is it not said that in the last days that the many will fall away giving head to seducing spirits and doctrines of demons? Is it not so that the Lord gave a call to repentance through John directed towards the Churches to turn from such things to save even their lamp stands from being removed? Unity at the loss of ones soul is not unity but death. It is the few that are chosen, these are the ones that escape such things and keep their lamp stands.

Faith_Warrior

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quote:
maybe God is punishing them or something.
On the contrary, Ezekiel 37 is being fulfilled before our eyes. Itís Satan that is doing the punishing for it is nearly his time.
ArchAngel

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quote:
So Iím ignorant becauseÖ I disagree with your viewsÖ yes so obviously Iím ignorant.

Faith_warrior, one of the lessons to be learned on this forum is that your wrong and ignorant if you disagree with warsong's priest.
I just gave up trying to debate. it's easier to converse with my wall, especially if their is someone is the next room.

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"Patience, my good citizen, patience. It's bad enough to rob a man of his dream"
-Sydney Carton, Tale of Two Cities
Soterion Studios

Lazarus

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Yeah I noticed Arch. He is kinda like my Dad(no offense, Warsong)...
My wall is a very good debater though.

Lazarus

ArchAngel

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I learn my best from the wall.

anyhow, yeah, I used to clash alot with warsong. but not anymore.
I guess resorting to throwing insults is probably not the way to go...

... hmmm...

oh well.

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"Patience, my good citizen, patience. It's bad enough to rob a man of his dream"
-Sydney Carton, Tale of Two Cities
Soterion Studios

CheeseStorm
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Well, we all agree that there's a problem. We disagree on who's causing the problem, so agreeing on a solution could be hard. I say we saturate them with Western stuff! Look at Japan before and after World War II. They were torturing prisoners and blowing themselves up like crazy until the boots got put to them. Now we're all jolly buds!

Problem is, it was the Emperor of Japan who surrendered, and there's no Terrorist Emperor. Still, getting them to change somehow is the only alternative to gunning them all down.

A lot of their kids get brain-washed at those super-religious schools where they learn about how great it is to die killing non-Muslims. There was a good story on the news about us Canadians in Afghanistan setting up a school there. Did you know when the Taliban were in charge, it was illegal to fly kites? We took a bunch of kites over there, too! Mahahaha.

So, uh... any volunteers to put on 100 lbs of kevlar and go teach over there?

Faith_Warrior

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quote:
gunning them all down.
I... think that happens in umm Ezekiel 38

Lazarus

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Tear down all their mosques and burn all their Koran's... but that would be religious persecution, wouldn't it? Well yeah, but at least they'd have a much harder time brainwashing their kids to be suicide bombers.

Ummmf! This 100lbs of kevlar sure is heavy...
And the teacher would be wearing it because... He never knows whether little 4 yr-old Ahmed or Mohammed in the front row are gonna stick some C4 in their math book or maybe a bomb in their desk and then blow everyone to kingdom come.

It's sick..

Lazarus

CheeseStorm
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Maybe we can just have educational TV shows to show them how much the rest of the world owns. Then they can learn how to build their own kites.
Lazarus

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And then one of the kids makes a kite with Mohammed's picture on it and they'd go on a jihad against kites. Then some news network would show a picture of the kite while telling the story and they'd start another against TV's...

Lazarus

CheeseStorm
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Lol, kite-jihad. I say we bomb them with Pokemon cards, and they'll focus on those instead of bomb-making.
ArchAngel

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hmm... get them on something productive... I like your thinking

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"Patience, my good citizen, patience. It's bad enough to rob a man of his dream"
-Sydney Carton, Tale of Two Cities
Soterion Studios




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You guys are good guys but I disagree and think you are wrong just like how you think I am wrong.
I think people should finish college first to know more but itís interesting to see some opinions. No hard feelings guys but I have been in debating and had to write up 15 page reports for one project let alone weekly projects. Getting to the truth is not as easy as some think of it to be since many times people cater to one side unfairly and they do not see it.

Laz you talk about your dad a lot, I donít know it your comments are good or bad to always compare me to him. lol
As for the pope backing down I think he should not have but o well. It seems that he tried to put into hot water the orthodox church against the Muslim in that comment since the orthodox church seems to have the best relationship with Muslims, and most non Christian sects.

Also your comment to burn down mosques is not a Christian method and you force your ideology on others which your view could be wrong as well. Maybe the Indians should burn every ones churches since they donít push for sexual or immoral acts in their movies.

As for Israeliís yes they are mostly not religious and Jews in the US are mostly atheists up to or over 90%. They heavily vote for liberal causes outside of Israel, but choose to push for more conservative causes in Israel which is kind of strange or bad in what they do to others. If it was not for them they Liberal party would have no power in the US since they are the main contributors.

Faith you say the country would be Marxist but that ideology was helped made by Jews which I guess they got power in communist Russia since many believed that someone that is not Christian would be good to run Russia and punish Christians just like how Christians are being is becoming bad every year in the US.

And again to support Israel and support Jews are 2 different matters since that statement can be easily said 70 years ago to support Israel which would be the Palestinians but many went against Israel to have an ethnic cleaning of Palestinians so that Jews can move in and the Palestinians donít like that someone took their land and massacred their people and are getting away with it which the support of people that donít know what is going on. Their was a reason why God took the land away from them, and the land was not even theirs the first time and have gotten it by invading it. Muslims are no saints but they are not the problem to every thing that is wrong. Jews and Muslims worked hand in hand for thousands of years without much problems and even help take down many Christian holy places. Sheesh even the Jews help bring in to the US and many other nations Muslims with their liberal views. There is no good guy or bad guy but everyone doing what is best for themselves.

Archangel
I just emphatically disagree. If you were a teacher and your students say 1+1=11 would you call that an opinion and better to talk to the wall even though they donít get it? Lol I give the information straight and donít candy coat the situation. I donít think anyone is stupid but lack enough information.

Cheesestorm
Letís come up with a formula in what should be addressed to look for the truth. One thing would be is to equally say bad and good things of both sides, to look for past actions they did, and to look at it mathematically and not take politically correctness and mood swings or feelings into account since facts donít cater feelings and if it did then math class would require whoever cries the most to get their answer right.
For example letís take something that would offend some. Dense things do not float as well, dense bones do not float as well, and doctors say that black people have more dense bones. Makes me now wonder if I ever saw a black get an Olympic gold in swimming? One site said a black woman won a medal but the official records show there was none so I guess some like to hype things up. http://www.sptimes.com/2004/04/23/State/City_seeking_black_po.shtml
Or female firefighters in how men are on average stronger than women because men are stronger genetically, so to be a fire fighter you need to lift heavy things which many men are not accepted. So for an average woman to carry over 200 pounds up a ladder. Now is this sexist?
Sure there are the exceptions just like how their can be albino snakes, tigers, humans, etc but that is not the norm and you canít set a standard norm based on exceptions. Why I say those? Well because some might be offended to show an example.

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"The conversion of a savage to Christianity is the conversion of Christianity to savagery." George Bernard Shaw (Hence christian sects)"Hell is paved with good intentions, not with bad ones"
"Matthew 7 21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;... depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
Orthodoxy=best kept secret in the US. 2nd largest Christian communion in the world

luke

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I havent read much of this article, but:
Its interesting isn't it?
When the pope insults the 'religion of peace' by quoting a Byzantine emperor(an empire which was later destroyed by muslims... go figure)... the peacful muslims reply with "How dare you insult my religion, I'll kill you for it!"

The civilians killed by Israel were accidental tragedies. The civilians killed by Hesbolla were successful strikes.

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If you can see Chuck Norris, He can see You.
If you Can't see Chuck Norris, you may be seconds away from death.




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luke lol
yep

Did you hear a journalist might got o jail for speech crimes becasue he called the 1915-18 Turkish massacre of Armanian genocide?

Another reason why Israel picks on the muslims sicne they the muslims are nuts. But they also push for laws to bring them into every country. I don't like they game they are playing, but they are playing with fire.

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"The conversion of a savage to Christianity is the conversion of Christianity to savagery." George Bernard Shaw (Hence christian sects)"Hell is paved with good intentions, not with bad ones"
"Matthew 7 21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;... depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
Orthodoxy=best kept secret in the US. 2nd largest Christian communion in the world

Lazarus

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From: USA
Registered: 06-06-2006
Yeah, those "peaceful" muslims are so peaceful they've only murdered millions worldwide for thousands of years.
I sure hope they never decide to go to war...
Now excuse me while I laugh my head off.

Every time I hear Bush say "Islam, the religion of peace" - I wonder if he knows what 2+2 is, because that is so idiotic.
It's not going to make me go around harassing muslims or ostracizing them, but I'm sure as heck not entering any mosque without backup(namely a Glock in my pocket...)

These doggone muslims in the US have several organizations, and a couple times I've seen them on TV complaining about racism, religious persecution, whatever.
Don't you just want to vomit?
Islamic countries: some facts.
Women are treated like slaves.
Speak out against the religion of peace, or convert to another, and those peaceful muslims are gonna murder you or worse, usually.
Children are abused in unspeakable ways.
If you've seen video of the Taliban, you know what it's like. The Koran is followed to the letter usually and any disobedience is punished with death.

Lazarus

zookey

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From: Great Falls, Montana, USA
Registered: 04-28-2002
I don't usually comment in forums like this but I do have to say something:

with saying Muslims are violent--be careful treading that water----people could say that all christians are violent because of the Crusades or the Inquisition or an abortion clinic being bombed---then it could turn on us---burn all the churches burn all the Bibles----hatred and judgementalism is a very slipery slope and, once you slide all the way down it, there is no difference between you and Al-Qada, the KKK or any other hate-based organization.

When I used to work for XrucifiX (way back in the day when it was called Two Guys Software---) Mack had a great quote on the site back then:

One must be careful when hunting monsters lest he himself too become a monster

SO...don't like what Bin Laden did? Then have enough balls to do (and, I might mention, what Jesus commands us to do!)----love people anyways. Don't let 9/11 make you hate every single person from the middle east or, just because someone says they are muslim, assume they are a suicide bomber. Either way, part of Christianity is understanding there is more than the eye can see and, as Jesus said, our enemy isn't people on this earth it is spiritual forces of darkness----so feel sorry for suicide bombers because they don't know that they are being played like puppets---and don't make the same mistake of allowing blind or ignorant hatred to get a grip on your life and allow Satan to play you the same way he played the bomber---because then you are A) no different than the bomber and B) have stopped being a positive force for God in the world.

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Lazarus

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True, hopefully I didn't come across that way. There are millions of muslims who would never think about committing terrorists acts.

So actually they aren't following the Koran right...

Lazarus

Simon_Templar

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Posts: 330
From: Eau Claire, WI USA
Registered: 10-25-2004
Do you want to know why there are high civilian casualties in wars with Hezbollah, and Hamas, and in the insurgency in Iraq for that matter?

Because the islamic forces deliberately hide behind civilians. The deliberatly put "innocents" in harms way. Why? because the death of these people benifits them. It makes Israel and the US look bad, it gives fodder to the liberal dupes who run the "world community" (who themselves are a bunch of corrupt, self serving, greedy swine.

First off, chuches like the Episcopalians, the Methodists (UMC), etc are so degenerate to begin with that it is a stretch to even call them christian. I aught to know, I was a member of the Episcopal church. The fact that the Orthodox and Catholics agree with them should be a concern to you (or anyone of those churches). The Presby's and the Church of Christ are only slightly better off.. very very slightly. Of the churches listed the only ones that I would not automaticly dismiss out of hand as totally comprimised are the orthodox and the cahtolics. Sadly they both have a history of a long history of racism against Jews which pretty much invalidates what they have to say about Israel.

Secondly, the moral standards of ANYONE who castigates Israel and either says nothing or even tacitly supports the muslims, must be so completely out of touch with reality that I'm really not willing to listen to them anymore.

We're dealing with people who deliberately and purposefully Kill women and children because they know that doing so gives them the greatest impact. We're dealing with people who train THEIR OWN CHILDREN to strap bombs to themselves and blow themselves up, in hopes that they can kill some Jews. We're dealing with people who, as I said above, deliberately put non-combatants in harms way and use non-combatants as shields because it makes their enemies look bad.

Do you know why the muslims hide behind civilians? Because they know that Israel and the US actually care about killing civilians. They know that their enemies actually have a sense of humanity and care about human life.

http://masoret.hevre.co.il/hydepark/topic.asp?topic_id=1990937
These guys are obviously a bunch of degenerate murdering savages... thats what the world would have you believe anyway.

There is a simple quote that contains a profound truth...

"If the Arabs put down their weapons today, tomorrow there would be peace.
If the Jews put down their weapons today, tomorrow there would be no Israel."

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-- All that is gold does not glitter,
Deep roots are not touched by the frost,
The old that is strong does not wither,
Not all those who wander are lost.

Faith_Warrior

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Posts: 490
From: So.Cal.
Registered: 09-05-2006
quote:
Faith you say the country would be Marxist but that ideology was helped made by Jews which I guess they got power in communist Russia since many believed that someone that is not Christian would be good to run Russia and punish Christians just like how Christians are being is becoming bad every year in the US.

And again to support Israel and support Jews are 2 different matters since that statement can be easily said 70 years ago to support Israel which would be the Palestinians but many went against Israel to have an ethnic cleaning of Palestinians so that Jews can move in and the Palestinians donít like that someone took their land and massacred their people and are getting away with it which the support of people that donít know what is going on.



Who... who who taught you this stuff??? This is so like far left one would fall off the edge of the world if they took another step. You know who the Marxists are, right? This is the dominant power behind the left. It's has little to do with Russia, really. Iím referring to much of the Democrat party and some of the indie parties. Many of the Dems are flaming Marxists! They want the US to be more like old Russia or like Cuba. Some of the Reps are pretty scary too, in fact.

As for the Jews, they didn't just move in and start grabbing land 70 years ago, they were actually the Palestinians that lived there and were [u]called[/u] Palestinians. Jews lived there during WWII and assisted the allies in winning the war. Other than the Jews there were some settlements around the area but not much to speak of because the land was a barren desert (unlike it is today). These "Palestinians" are mostly from the surrounding nations that were abandoned there after the Jews started to turn the deserts into gardens. No one gave a dump about the land until the Jews did, and ever since then the nations have done nothing but to try to destroy the land and drowned the Jews in the sea as they threaten to do.




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Laz
I agree with what you said. But Bush has to say that the Muslim and Jewish religion is good just like everyone else. The Wall Street Journal says that Jews that are less than 3-5% in the US contribute over 50% to both republican and democratic parties even though they vote heavily 90% for liberal causes which hurt Christians and they know it and admit it. Christians donít get along with Muslims so they bring more Muslims in the US and Europe and if things continue in 25-50 years the majority of Europe will be Muslim. Jews can deal with Muslims which is why they put their put their country in the middle of the Muslims. Some might say they are nuts to go their but they know what they are doing and ever since they went their place has been unstable after thousands of years of no violence in that region and the Muslims are getting killed more then Jews. These are not coincidences and their was a reason why God took the land away from them because of the problems, oy vai the head aches God gets again, another reason why so many Christians, other religions, and other countries that live near the region say the say thing since they dealt with it first hand.

If you look at most of the replies in the forum you will see people from North America that donít know about the place and think they know better than the people near them. Itís like you assessing a construction site form the other side of the world by just one a one sided info than being there to see it for yourself, and thatís not rational. You know?

Zookey
Letís clarify something, Many Muslims want good just like every good person in this forum, but the Muslim religion is not good. As Laz said the good Muslims are the ones that do not follow it well. People should not judge on individuals but itís ok to judge on association on what you believe like your views. For example in a European country they are arresting everyone that believes in Satanism since there has been many killings for satanic rituals, itís their belief but their belief is hurting others despite we are picking at all Satanists. And many other things in history that a country took control to categories a group of people e that are associated with corrupt or extremely wrong views that hurt others. Obviously is it bad to force them to be good or convert since that it no better than the criminals just like the protestants and Catholics have done to get wide acceptance from doing so which makes them no better than Muslims or the people that converted or worse.
AS for the crusades it is odd that most people know if for Christians attacking Muslims but that is BS propaganda, and many people that did look into it and historians know that it was the fake Christians manipulating the Christian people to attack the orthodox Christians and destroyed many Christian holy places and taken many artifacts which the pope admitted and said he was sorry for but did not want to give back any of the artifacts back to the Orthodox Church, and then the Muslims enslaves them for close to half a millennium with the help of Jews that gave them weapons which they admit themselves and they prospered under Muslim rule and gotten rich while the Christians suffered persecuted and did not prosper. Itís odd how they all admit it but no one heard about it. Itís like good cop bad cop in a way. Even now there are Jewish holidays like Honokaa that are against the foundation of Christianity anti Christian even though their holy books do not mention them which Jews admit. When the Christian leaders admit it no one listens which I explained to Laz just now why.
As you said there is more than the eye can see.


Simon
Read what I said to the others as well since you know a lot more than some here but you still say a lot of errors and it is scary.
Both sides hide behind civilians, just because you heard one site does not mean you have to play it to death. Lol If you were being attacked you go to a safe place and that is where the other is not allowed to attack since the other is supposed to be ďgoodĒ as you say to care about human life and follow the rules. Even Jewish leaders say that one Jewish finger nail is not worth 1000 Muslim lives and is that racism? I guess to you the only 2 people that are infallible are God and Jews but I guess God comes second since a lot of things you have said is against god in how you present your views it seems. Jews and no better than anyone else and Even Christ said everyone is equal despite giving a lashing to the Jews so quit putting anyone on a pedestal. But Israel has a list of war crimes that makes Muslims shutter in fear and the UN and EU doesnít want to deal with them since many of them men have been killed by Israel ďintentionallyĒ on many occasions and even the UN base that said in big letter UN was attacked on top of hill to be observes to see the action what goes on have been all killed. Why isnít it said more on the news you might ask well it would be bad to say that your allies, political contributors, etc be shown in a bad light so have the scrape goat the ďother religion of peaceĒ (Muslims) since their track record is bad for everything.

As for your other comments about the churches you still have a lot of info to catch up with and again many of your points are off, but you are getting better so keep on reading. The Orthodox Church doesnít agree with any other church, and the ones that do in the US are acting like Bush since they have to or else they will be shut down replaces or worse. Whatever Orthodox Church said what you agreed on have been bombed just like all the churches in Kosovo which is over 100 including Christian cemeteries and the rest of Kosovo. Do you justify that war since more people got killed too since the soldiers hide with the people? The general Wesley Clark is Jewish and he wanted to wipe out all the Christians to bring the Muslim their. The Orthodox Church has a lot of land in Israel and had it before Jews came and they have been attacking them, and you call them racist? The Orthodox Church helped the Jews more and all they get from Jews is being persecuted and for you to say that makes you automatically kind of evil and evil to good. Also that fact that more Orthodox people died in the war for Jews, communist Russia was run by Jews and killed many Orthodox Christians and priest let alone communism was made by Jews like, Israel attacking orthodox churches and you know you thinks that is fair. Your opinion is interesting but you lack a lot of information to say a lot of the things you say.

As for your quote that is not true since if you role back the clock 100 years Jews and Muslims did not have a problem in that regions as we do now. Arabs did put down their weapons and the Jews massacred them which you ignore. This is the difference from people in the US and people outside since the rest of the world that is near both of them get it while the people that did not deal with them donít. Itís like me judging how your home is and I never been their or dealt with it and only hear a neighbor that you donít get along with.

Everyone does their job and the only people that donít are the ďChristiansĒ that let lies and propaganda grow, just like how the alleged Christian crusaders went and attacked all the Christian nations and many still donít get it.

Faith
Yes both sides are scary lol, I explained it to Laz just now. Jews didnít assist much in ww2, even general Patton slapped 2 Jews that didnít want to fight and wanted others to fight for them. HE helped win the war and the Jews didnít like him go figure. As for the land it was not theirs to take and the Brits helped them and it was not theirs to give, and they went their and killed a lot of Palestinians.

------------------
"The conversion of a savage to Christianity is the conversion of Christianity to savagery." George Bernard Shaw (Hence christian sects)"Hell is paved with good intentions, not with bad ones"
"Matthew 7 21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;... depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
Orthodoxy=best kept secret in the US. 2nd largest Christian communion in the world

Lazarus

Member

Posts: 1668
From: USA
Registered: 06-06-2006
You know, I read a book once that said many of the same things Warsong just did.

Lazarus

Faith_Warrior

Member

Posts: 490
From: So.Cal.
Registered: 09-05-2006
quote:
Originally posted by warsong:

Jews didnít assist much in ww2, even general Patton slapped 2 Jews that didnít want to fight and wanted others to fight for them. HE helped win the war and the Jews didnít like him go figure. As for the land it was not theirs to take and the Brits helped them and it was not theirs to give, and they went their and killed a lot of Palestinians.


Wow, thatís amazing! Patton went to Palestine and slapped around two Jews that wouldnít fight. Which revisionist history book did this come out of? Actually the Palestinian Jews were too busy doing missions for Brittan at the time to have time to be slapped around by Patton. Not just men either, but women were in the fight as well. Meanwhile, other countries in that region were in support of Hitler and his little Naziís, itís like people would rather reward those countries (or appease) for their decisions to do evil.




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Laz
??? You scare me sometimes. lol

Faith
Lol thatís funny but no thatís not what I meant I just gave a small silly example which I am sure you heard about General Pattonís actions and comments about Jews how they get special treatment while others suffer and found it BS. A lot of them were acting sick to get out of it and Patton got pissed.

Here is what Wikipedia quotes on what Patton said
ďWe entered a synagogue which was packed with the greatest stinking bunch of humanity I have ever seen. Either these Displaced Persons never had any sense of decency or else they lost it all during their period of internment by the Germans... My personal opinion is that no people could have sunk to the level of degradation these have reached in the short space of four yearsĒ
And thatís the main guy that helped the US win the war to help the Jews and the majority didnít like what the Jews were doing but had to help, since they have to clean up the mess Jews started, just like how the tile of the topic is how most religious figures and countries agree. Anyway the point of the article is about Israelís violations and abuse which many that have dealt with them agree on and the ones that have not say things they donít know about. If it was not for WW1 and WW2 Jews might not have gotten Israel and after that Israel has never had peace again with its Muslims and ďnon MuslimĒ neighbors. Well if you make money with wars Israel makes a lot of money, since last year they made over 20billion thanks to the US. And the war causes more problems and hatred and so you get longer and more wars and if you are making over 20billion a year you would not want that income to end and also get nukes and other benefis that other nations donít get.

One of the biggest contributes to Hitler to gain power before WW2 were wealthy Jewish Americans and news papers and was even made Man of the year. But they also made Stalin man of the year 2 times and Stalin killed far more people (orthodox Christians) than Hitler did. More Christians died in the war but no Christian museums or the other genocides that Hitler did against the Orthodox counties which he wanted to wipe out all the slaves. Even the Catholic Church went to orthodox countries and said convert or die.

As for Israel a former prim minister said that if they were the Palestinians they would feel the same way if someone took their land and killed their people. And the Jews wanted all the Germans wiped out after WW2 which was a bit racist of them to want an entire nation wiped out. But then again many find them infallible but as I said they are the same as everyone else and no one should get special treatment.

Anyway letís try to get back on topic, and as it says they get 20billion every year when US goes to war and so people should boycott them since Muslims, Christians, Jews, and the rest of the world gets hurt badly in the end and these actions are definitely unchristian, of do we need for things to get far worse so that people can see it?
Read international news and history to make better sense of it all.

[This message has been edited by warsong (edited October 08, 2006).]