Posts: From: Registered: |
I found a site that explains how movies like that are subliminal. Well think about it. The movie is about x-men being individuals even if it bothers others. If a mutant has the ability to blow up the world then its ok if they can deal with it and not others. A hero takes care of others and not themselves. Dont know why people view celebrities like sports players, actors, singer, etc like heroes when they do more damage than good, and they do what they do for themselves. The movie seems to embrace many liberal views which is not imposed directly but indirectly to set the foundation of how people should think like evolution, homosexuality, god complexes, selfishness; mutations have no side affects, etc. Well Hollywood is liberal and is puts in their views to impose it on others. Kind of like broke back mountain we are the bad guys that they 2 men can express their homosexual feeling for each other. It doesnt take into account both sides of the issue and proclaims they are the good guys with fancy special affect, action, and hype. http://www.sydneyanglicans.net/culture/watching/x_men_3_the_last_stand/ ""They cant cure us, rages Storm. Because there is nothing wrong with us!" "And that is where the rub of the film lies. There is a brief acknowledgement that individual expression must be limited to the non-destructive, but that is primarily for the good of the individual themselves, not those who have to co-exist with them. However individuality that admits no limits other than its own benefit results in a greater tyranny than any fascist state could offer. Now, to be fair, the good guys are all for control for the sake of others, but I dont think thats where X Men 3 is really going. It is one of the enduring contradictions of modern society that we maintain that it is possible for everyone to have what they want, and no-one need suffer. But the essence of Biblical thinking is to realize that when every man does as he sees fit the result is chaos, not harmony. Its an old Sunday school illustration, but the essence of sin is putting I at the centre. When will we meet a group of super-heroes who believe that heroism actually means living for others? I am forcefully reminded of that greatest of champions who was in the form of God; yet laid no claim to equality with God, but made himself nothing and was obedient, even to the point of death on a cross. (Philippians 2:6-8)." It is interesting to see how to justify an argument they twist it around to a different view to appeal to many and alter their thinking over time. But anyway if you are still interesting well look at the overall reviews of the movie which doesnt seem to be good. http://www.metacritic.com/film/titles/xmenthelaststand ------------------ [This message has been edited by warsong (edited May 29, 2006).] |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
I actually found the movie to be non-humanist. X-men supported putting aside one's personal desires for the greater good, and Magneto propagates meeting your potential and following your own desires, and your own version of "good." Magneto is always talking about "being who you are supposed to be" while Xavier teaches using the powers for good. ------------------ |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
quote: Hey, she uses her powers to help humans and mutants, not for personal gain. The evil mutants think they're better than regular humans. The normal humans are scared of differences so they want to make everyone the same. "Rargh!" - The Beast |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
Doesn't everyone know that Hollywood is nothing but just a stomping ground for Liberal propaganda? ------------------ |
|
luke Member Posts: 311 From: I use your computer as my second Linux box Registered: 10-30-2005 |
I find that most movies, politics and beliefs aside are OK as far as plot goes. But when I start noticing those little things it pushes like Gay is OK etc... then well you know. But I don't see what all the controversy about the Da Vinci Code is, I mean it is a work of fiction not a High School text book. ------------------ |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
Dan Brown does stand by the stuff he writes in it, tho. ------------------ |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
(edit) ------------------ [This message has been edited by lava (edited May 30, 2006).] |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Let's all have a nice reminder that Fiction is Fiction. Don't go reading too much stuff into it or you'll get angry and whatnot. Movies are made for entertainment, when you take them too seriously that aspect of them disappears. Just don't think about it too much. I can't see a Gay rights or Evolutionist movement quoting X-Men as a good source for arguement. It won't fuel any debate and, like I said, its just for entertainment. ------------------ |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
however, entertainment and art many times is used by their creators to form a point, to bring about a message, or to ask a question. and if not that, it could be used by the viewers to extrapolate and illustrate their own concepts. looking into these things for deeper meanings can be quite beneficial.
------------------ |
|
bennythebear Member Posts: 1225 From: kentucky,usa Registered: 12-13-2003 |
don't we have better things to do than debate over the meaning of movie? first there's the whole trying-to-get-the-lost-saved thing, then there's people starving, homeless... real tyranny and oppression going on. i'm not saying i focus on this all the time and i'm out there giving everything, but why is it people always focus on on vain topics? ------------------ proverbs 25:7 www.gfa.org - Gospel for Asia www.persecution.com - Voice of the Martyrs |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
Benny for the win. | |
Ereon Member Posts: 1018 From: Ohio, United States Registered: 04-12-2005 |
Lol, I second Cheese on the Benny vote. ------------------ "I am very good at hiding, so if you don't see me, that's where I am." Orc Outlaw, TES III Morrowind |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
i... third it? lol... but, i have to mention... what about Kurt Wagner, the Nightcrawler, from the second movie? there's a scene where Storm is angry, and he says 'someone so beautiful should not be so angry..' and she says that anger can sometimes save your life, and he says 'so can faith.'.. he's constantly praying during the movie, and he says something about having 'one for every sin, so quite a few', but i don't remember what he was talking about. plus, what archangel said. ------------------ |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
So if we're not arguing about a movie we're posting in a 28 page topic regarding how someone hasn't experienced puberty yet. I admit it is a vain topic but this isn't the exactly the most active forum out there. ------------------ |
|
Ereon Member Posts: 1018 From: Ohio, United States Registered: 04-12-2005 |
The result of that, in my opinion, is that we have comparatively few people here focusing solely on game design or other forms of development. Many of the people here have more interest in discussing the subjects that discuss.....if that makes sense. ------------------ "I am very good at hiding, so if you don't see me, that's where I am." Orc Outlaw, TES III Morrowind |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
yay ereon... now can you explain the second to last sentence just a little more? i think you left out a word or something... ------------------ |
|
Simon_Templar Member Posts: 330 From: Eau Claire, WI USA Registered: 10-25-2004 |
I'm not a comic guru by any stretch, but its pretty obvious and pretty basic that the primary theme of all Stan Lee/marvel comics is "with great power/ability comes great responsability". In every one of his comics the hero is a person who realizes this and struggles with the implications of devoting themselves to the responsability they have been given, and trying to reconcile that with the desire to be a normal human being, and have a life of their own. In pretty much every case the villians are those who are given great power and use it for personal ends (even sometimes understandable personal ends). In the movie X-Men last stand (which was by far the worst of the trilogy in my opinion), the point of the movie deals directly with the basic question of any free society.. what is the balance between self control and freedom. Magnito, on the other hand believes that self control is just a straight jacket that others are trying to force upon them. His view leads to chaos, and warfare. The movie highlights the necessity of moral restraint and self control to maintaining a free and peaceful society. Tangentially you could also argue that the movie deals with the question of wether or not freedom can exist in a highly technological society. In the movie the question is posed regarding mutants who can read minds, and other amazing talents, can normal people be free if those kinds of things exist? But we face the same question in regards to the growing ability of government to monitor and control every aspect of our lives. In a world where government must maintain vast networks to monitor telecommunications of every kind, to spy on their enemies, to protect themselves, etc how can we be sure those things won't be turned on us.. and can we truly maintain freedom under such circumstances. ------------------ |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
I disagree LOL Obviously some people fall in the truth traps. Its not about the good side they show but the one side that they show which is not better than the other side which sways peoples outlook on things. I dont know the full plot of the movie and will wait until it comes on TV, so I will just try to give people some challenging questions to think about. Lol People ignore the main concept of metaphors. Read my reply to the other as well since everyone seems to cross ideas and pat eacho0ther on the back so soon. Arch Cheese Lava Luke Capnstank Benny Budboy Ereon Simon
------------------ |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
You know, I was almost insulted when I didn't see my name on the list at first, lol.
quote: lol..... ------------------ [This message has been edited by lava (edited June 02, 2006).] |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
ahh, in Trigun, the priest repents of what he done. Trigun was a pretty good series, I will say. I did, after all, buy a model of the Priest (Wolfwood) with his cross gun. ------------------ |
|
Simon_Templar Member Posts: 330 From: Eau Claire, WI USA Registered: 10-25-2004 |
I always find it funny in a slightly annoying way when christians complain about the fact that movies, tv shows, or books, portray good characters as having flaws. This is one of the primary reasons that "christian" entertainment forms often are of lower quality. They have characters that aren't really human. People, even good people, have problems and flaws. It is the struggle with those flaws, and imperfections that make us able to identify with characters. This is one of the primary reasons that Christian entertainment comes across as preachy and unreal. They can't present normal human flaws without making them a big sermon, if they can present them at all. Furthermore, when christians condemn 'secular' entertainment for having flawed characters it just comes across like grasping at straws, looking for any reason possible to demonize something they don't like. ------------------ |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Yes entertainment does contain attempts at metaphors, and 1/2 truthes but I really don't let them effect me as most people do. Understanding and recognising the things within them is half the battle. I live my life by my own choices and morals (yes athiets do have morals, we've been through this) not by what a trendy movie will tell me. When entertainment controls society is when there's problems. Being smart enough to make your own decisions not what someone else tells you is the better thing to do in my opinion. ------------------ |
|
That_Guy Member Posts: 30 From: TN,USA Registered: 02-26-2005 |
quote: Magneto is the bad guy. ------------------ |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
Uh-oh, Warsong, that actor also played Gandalf in The Lord of the Rings; perhaps Sauron was in fact Jesus Christ after his public image was twisted by the mass media's dark hold on the Free Peoples of Middle Earth... Oh, just kidzorz. Then again, he was in the Da Vinci Code, fighting against the Church's cover-up. You may be on to something this time! ^_^ *edits ze typos* [This message has been edited by CheeseStorm (edited June 04, 2006).] |
|
Max Member Posts: 523 From: IA Registered: 09-19-2004 |
It was a movie... Things blowing up, and cool powers, I personally never thought about any underlying stuff till I read this article. ------------------ Blind belief is dangerous. - Kenyan Proverb Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. - Pablo Picasso |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
quote: Would we expect anything less? lol jp ------------------ [This message has been edited by lava (edited June 04, 2006).] |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
People vote with their wallets and when they go pay for movies that have people that attack you then they will use the money to support liberal view and persuade more people in their views. Hence the increase in many liberal programs while the family is being destroyed. Keep on giving money to BS and we will get more BS to eat. Maybe I should make a new topic about it but since we are talking about movies and so many get distracted with special FX then they will miss the big picture. just like a magic trick to look at the one hand distracts you and the other does its thing to trick you. Kind of like trick or treat every day of the year, we get tricked and they get the treats and people love getting tricked again and again. Archangel Simon Cap Your quote also shows how you are affected when “no Christian can be a murderer (1 John 3:15)“ Mahatma Gandhi didn’t get it. He put his people to get slaughtered every day. He is no better than anyone and his saying that you have is without thought. The Original Christian church Orthodoxy didn’t do anything bad to them. If anything they thank them for freeing them from the Persians with the help of King Alexander which influenced them and helped paved the road for Christianity. The other non Orthodox church did bad and unchristian things since they are not considered Christian by the Orthodox church. As my saying says “The conversion of a savage to Christianity is the conversion of Christianity to savagery” which many put their own cultural views in it to dilute the religion. So if it was not for non Christian actions like the catholic and protestant sects you would most likely be Christians, but you are not since naturally bad bring bad, and can not bring good. As for his comment about Christ well he said so many errors so that is just another error he made on his long list. That guy CheeseStorm lol Max Laval ------------------ |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
@warsong To me, it's just entertainment mostly. Even the news is entertainment, and usually has bad things in it too. If you watch TV, you better be prepared for the effects it will have on you, good or bad. Lazarus ------------------ |
|
Max Member Posts: 523 From: IA Registered: 09-19-2004 |
Warsong, I think you are thinking too much. People will never have mutant powers, therefor, all that stuff is pointless. Woohoo, Wolverine can't get on a plane, that's what his motorcycle is for. Anyhoo,My favorite character is Colossus, what about you guys? ------------------ Blind belief is dangerous. - Kenyan Proverb Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. - Pablo Picasso |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
Cyclops, but then I have only seen the 1st one, and I plan to see the 2nd soon. ------------------ |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
quote: Haha, I thought he was going to fight the Juggernaught at the end. (that would've been insanely cool) Don't really have a favorite. Wolverine or Nightcrawler I guess. [This message has been edited by CheeseStorm (edited June 07, 2006).] |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Sliding away from topic, but about Gandhi... his people made a choice, and let's be obvious here, death was a decision for them. Gandhi was a spiritual leader who believed that by using violence you hurt yourself more than you do your victum. When you look closely at many violent events you see the evidence of that. His people followed him to their deaths believing it was the right thing to do, a self-sacrifice if you will. I'm sure you've heard this from me before, but allowing others to control your decisions isn't a good life, just being another sheep in the herd. I'm hoping this can end here but like I've said we've been through the topic of morals and how religion apperently relates to them. I just don't think that you understand that someone who isn't Christian can be a good person as well. I've done more good for people in my life than some "Christians" that I know. I'll let you get your 2 cents in if you want, but don't go making it big topic here. Back to topic. I believe that mutations such as those portrayed in Xmen are impossible but I believe what we can develope into as a species has potential far greater than we've seen. It's said that we only use 10% of our brains, and if we met with a person centries in the future who understand the mind, how to control it, etc. better than we do we may say that they have mutant abilities such as the Xmen's leader. (you know, the guy in the chair!) Favorite? None. I'll be honest that I never was into comic books. If I had to pick a favorite comic character though I'd go along the lines of The Hulk. ------------------ |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
All the good in the world doesn't save you, CapnStank. You can be Hitler or Gandhi, and if you repent of your sins you'll go to heaven. You can be Mother Teresa or some really good person, and if you don't repent of your sins, you won't go to heaven; you'll go to the other place. Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Lazarus |
|
Ereon Member Posts: 1018 From: Ohio, United States Registered: 04-12-2005 |
That claim of the 10% of our brains theory is a myth propogated by experiments preformed on rats. Scientists were able to extract roughly 90% of the rats brain by selectively removing certain areas that were non-essential to the rat's basic involuntary bodily function and have the rat survive. However, the rats in the experiement exhibited extremely hampered abilities and were not able to perform nearly as well as other rats in exercises such as solving a maze or similar things that required through or something other than involuntary actions such as breathing or the heart beating. So, there is no evidence to suggest that we use on 10% of our brains. ------------------ "I am very good at hiding, so if you don't see me, that's where I am." Orc Outlaw, TES III Morrowind |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Lazarus, you should know that I'm not expecting to be saved. I've explained before that I don't believe in it. The point I was trying to make is that warsong generalizes athiests as cruel people because they follow a different pattern of beliefs. I'm just trying to explain to him that just because a person doesn't believe the same stuff he does it doesn't make them a evil or moralless person. The whole part about repenting is retarded if you ask me. Go through life making everyone else's hell day in and day out, then have a revelation in the end and repent soulfully and somehow that makes you a good enough person to step through the pearly gates? ------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
Colossus? who's he again? mine would probably be Wolverine or Nightcrawler, but they're all pretty cool... the whole Storm-prominence thing in the third movie was dumb... lol..
------------------ |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
Colossus turns out to be gay. lol. in some demented way, I find that funny.
------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
who is colossus?! lol.. ------------------ |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/70/X3cast16.jpg The 2nd one on the 2nd row, next to Angel. ------------------ [This message has been edited by lava (edited June 08, 2006).] |
|
Max Member Posts: 523 From: IA Registered: 09-19-2004 |
Colossus is the guy who can turn his skin to steel. Capn - Short response to the whole repent thing. If you make people lives hell day in and day out, and then suddenly realize that you want to repent, it works if you mean it in your heart/soul. I'm not expecting to "turn" you Capn, and I highly respect your views, just trying to explain it. If you just say the words, it doesn't work, you have to mean it. Hope that helped. ------------------ Blind belief is dangerous. - Kenyan Proverb Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. - Pablo Picasso |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
oh yah!! him... he was cool.. ------------------
RADIOACTIVE IE AHEAD! int name() |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
I understand the idea behind repenting, I just don't agree with it. Sure, your God may accept the soul-felt appology but what about the people that you harmed? Is there any assistance to them? Basically by this method if you go harrassing a non-christian day in, day out, then all of a sudden feel really bad and repent with all your heart and soul you get to heaven, but a person who just lived in a hell is still doomed to the abyss? I also realize that I won't 'turn' any of you, although my posts may come off as if I'm annoyed, confused, etc. I am just working to gather a better understanding of the other side of the arguement. ------------------ |
|
Max Member Posts: 523 From: IA Registered: 09-19-2004 |
Well, the fact is, if you've changed, and really wanted to repent, you would feel remorse for what you have done, and most likely God would lead you to apologize to the people you have harmed. I know it's hard to believe people can change, I am a massive cynic. I never give people the benefit of the doubt. If I see proof of it, or can just "tell" what they feel, then I believe it. You're missing the main point to it, Most of Christianity is about being a better person, to be Christ-like. Also, if someone just repents, means it, and never does anything like pray or use his talents, he is as good as dead. For the bible states that "Faith without works is death" and it works the other way to. You can do all the good deeds in the world, but you can't get to heaven with them. Hope that helped Capn, send me a message with a messenger address and I can try to better explain it, I understand your point, and it is very valid. I wish I could understand what you are meaning better. -Max ------------------ Blind belief is dangerous. - Kenyan Proverb Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. - Pablo Picasso |
|
crazyishone Member Posts: 1685 From: Registered: 08-25-2004 |
Actually max, i believe it goes "faith without works is dead". I only point this out, because it kinda matters. Its saying that your faith is useless (dead), if you don't do your part. Its not saying that if you don't have faith and good works you will die. (on any level, physical death, eternal damnation, etc.) ------------------ |
|
Ereon Member Posts: 1018 From: Ohio, United States Registered: 04-12-2005 |
I think personally that part of being truly repentant is trying to make things right. If you wronged someone, and you truly are repentant, then you will go back and make things right. ------------------ Of course God knew what would happen if they used their freedom the wrong way: apparently He thought it worth the risk. |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
I agree with Ereon. When Zaccheus repented, he returned fourfold what he'd stolen. The laws Moses gave the Israelites also say that if someone stole something, he'd have to give X number back. Btw, nice signature. I don't know why, a lot of Christians I meet think C.S Lewis wasn't one, he was a bad person, he perverted the Gospel, etc. I guess they think the Narnia series was bad too I've read those books so many times... Lazarus |
|
Ereon Member Posts: 1018 From: Ohio, United States Registered: 04-12-2005 |
Thanks, C.S. Lewis is one of my favorite authors, I'm working on a small collection of quotes by him to put in my sig. This was my first addition. ------------------ Of course God knew what would happen if they used their freedom the wrong way: apparently He thought it worth the risk. |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
capnstank Gandhi was not that spiritual since he was confused to not know who which got to choose. When someone asked him if he is Hindu he said he is Hindu, Christian, Muslims, etc. He was an educated smart man but not that smart. No one is perfect and neither is he to send his people like sheep to the slaughter. He was not that spiritual since he didnt explore that much to know that its an insult to say that there is many Gods and did thing for the future of his people than for the spirit, but that didnt work out so well, also the saying like that it shows. He was to the far left and anarchism which was similar to the other one that is far off the Dalai Lama which he also has done more to hurt his country than help it. So you cant honestly believe the quote you have which I explained it before why it is off. Some Christians are not good or real Christians and you can do good to be a better Christian than them even though you are not. Morals have their limit when people want to not pay attention to all the morals in the book. People like you and other Christians think they know more and do their own thing. Christianity is a map or a guide to how or what to do and without it is harder to find the right path. Christianity was influenced by the great philosophers of Ancient Greece as well if you look at many of the saying and the history of it as I posted in the religious forum. Even Buddha, Hinduism have been influenced by the same but fall short in many ways, which no matter what other views says Christianity has it already since they god it from the same source and Christianity had a better position since most of the apostles lived where the greatest intellects of all time were. Things with click if you explore more. The problems with your other part that that not being a Christian is ok is still an insult in a way to God dont you think? For example if someone like your parents, school, friends etc made you who you are, and you say you dont think so and think they dont exist then you are insulting them. If someone gave you a million dollars and all the want is gratitude and then you turn around and tell someone in front of the person that gave you the money that you dont want to thank the guy that gave you the money and that you dont want to thank him and never will, then what will happen? If you bite the hand the feeds you then will you get a reward? Max said some ok stuff for you to understand a bit on other aspects. You talk about repentance being BS well again you believe in metaphors? Well if your kid steals from a person and he benefits a lot and your other kid didnt then he is most likely not to get punished. But if your kid steals and benefits a lot but he repents and mean it and use what he benefited to give back what he stole with interests and never stole again and prevent others from doing the same, but your other kid didnt steal and didnt care to ever help others, then the one that stole would be a bigger man than the one that didnt steal at all. Obviously it would be hard for someone to be so humble but that is just a small example of repentance I came up with. Which if you ask yourself which kid did a more positive thing and showed his colors of who they are so that you trust? If liberal Hollywood praises someone then you know something is wrong. Since you know they use it to demonize and distort and praise people that are mostly unfit to be praised. Reminds me of a silly riddle how what if you die or go someplace and there is a person standing on a cross road and a sign that says there 2 people and one person is their at all times and one usually lies and the other person says the truth and you have to decide which road to take but you only ask 1 question to ask the person. The real problem is that no one says that they lie. I honestly think you need to talk to an expert like a priest and if you never have then what are you afraid of that he will be right? That you will waste your time? That you love what you do and dont want to admit that some things are bad since you are attached to it and that you will regret? It takes a bigger man to admit when they are wrong, and no need to tell us about it but go ask a priest which they used to be the original shrinks to advise people which had better results for 2000 years but now they have shrinks that dont work so well and more people have problems. ------------------ |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
quote: Well, he said he was from all those different religions because "Gandhi believed that at the core of every religion was Truth and Love." (Wikipedia). I disagree with a lot of Gandhi's ideas but I just wanted to clear that up. As for the Dalai Lama: "My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness." Nuff said ^_^ |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
I see capnstank didn't reply. Hollywoods movie association is rating a Christian movie pg13 to categories it up with other movies that have violence sex profanity etc. Like I said they dont want to encourage logical Christian values, and when they do they distort them. What else do you expect when the vast majority or people in the writers gild are fanatical anti-Christians that push for secular views? Sure they make semi Christian movies but they are just wolfs in sheeps clothing, just like the majority of actors that portray themselves as conservatives but are liberal. Cheese Even Ereaon in the other post thinks its kind not to kill and defend ones self at all even if someone crazy is trying to kill your family or countrymen.
[This message has been edited by warsong (edited June 15, 2006).] |
|
Ereon Member Posts: 1018 From: Ohio, United States Registered: 04-12-2005 |
LOL! Let's not bring up THAT discussion again . ------------------ Of course God knew what would happen if they used their freedom the wrong way: apparently He thought it worth the risk. Friendship is born at that moment when one person says to another: What! You too? I thought I was the only one. |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
Wow. Comparing the Dalai Lama to Hitler. You are a real piece of work. The irony is that you're the one always talking about twisted, distorted worldviews. *Edit* I'm done with this thread. I've decided that if you perceive the X-Men as a threat to your faith, that's your problem and not mine. If people like you start burning "witches" again, maybe I'll be a bit more concerned. Quote me, bash me, and get on with life. [This message has been edited by CheeseStorm (edited June 15, 2006).] |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
Ereon lol ok Cheese Who said anything about xmen weakening the faith but it does weaken people? As another saying goes when people think they are strong that is when they are vulnerable. If you think anything is ok then why not have live action homosexual actions on Saturday morning cartoons, on bill boards, or on kindergarten school books, etc? You obviously didnt read the post about marketing. Like the saying goes a sucker is born every minute and you know that no one is perfect which is why so many get affected. Your logic is like if you dropped an egg once then it must mean that you are not allowed to carry eggs ever. Everyone makes mistakes and to praise a mistake or error is worse than the mistake or error. Here are some quotes for you. [This message has been edited by warsong (edited June 15, 2006).] |
|
Max Member Posts: 523 From: IA Registered: 09-19-2004 |
Cheese's point is that what you are argueing doesn't matter. Dhali lama, stalin, hitler, who cares? ------------------ Blind belief is dangerous. - Kenyan Proverb Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. - Pablo Picasso |
|
NetCog Member Posts: 149 From: Registered: 06-15-2006 |
Geronimo...
quote:
But I did want to address one point:
Please pause a moment before continuing to read. oh yea, and Hi.
Again...I'm here for the ham and crackers...maybe a brownie or two if they're really good. latas
[This message has been edited by NetCog (edited June 16, 2006).] |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
um... how could fiction be a lie/sinning if they never purport it as true? hellooooooo... the name 'fiction' right off the bat tells you it's not true, and everahboday knows it. it does mean not fact! lol, discussion ovahr. lol... ------------------
RADIOACTIVE IE AHEAD! int name() |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Ug, wow I'm just going to post on that shot at me "looks like capnstank didn't reply" I DO have a life outside these forums and when school, work, real social life and whatnot arise they take priority over this. Don't try to take no reply as a sign of backing off. I just wonder sometimes about this site. A spam topic lasts for 28+ pages but when a coding topic or something christian rises it fizzles by 2nd page. Does everyone come here to vent spam, noise, and anger? ------------------ |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
Max Yeah I know I am just teasing him. Lol Netcog Buddboy Capstank ------------------ |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Me? Well right now I'm just using game maker until I get some better programs. I'm doing a top-down shooter by myself which I've lost lots of faith in and I'm working with a friend on an online game inspired by a Halo2 game we played on the internet and also an online version of the original pokemon (for fun). After I finish off those projects I'm planning on taking up C++ & DirectX to start a new project (no clue yet). I've been accepted to university for Software Engineering which I start in the fall. Languages I know (roughly, I'm not an expert in any) -GML (of course) -C++ -C -Java -Python -HTML ------------------ |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
Do you have any pics of the shooter game? ------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
whoa whoa whoa... fiction books are used to brainwash people? okay... so you're agreeing with him... lemme see what other cockamamie ideas you two agree on... NetCog, what's your views on african americans and jews? (remembers really crazy arguments) aaaah... them were the days... sort of. oh, i didn't counter what you said. hmmmmm... books are used to brainwash people. okay, then what about christian fiction? is that brainwashing people to believe in christianity? noooooo... of course not, right? why is other fiction 'brainwashing' people. why do you think fiction is lying? its beyond me why anyone would think that, but then again, our society is totally ignoring the biological fact that two women cannot have a child... never know what people will believe. ------------------
RADIOACTIVE IE AHEAD! int name() |
|
NetCog Member Posts: 149 From: Registered: 06-15-2006 |
I think I sent you a pm buddboy? | |
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
yah, i already read it. all it did was give a bunch of crapola about jesus told parables, possibly fiction possibly not. and some questions about when does fiction become a lie. almost never. cuz it's just a story. that isn't purported as truth. never has been. never will. it's a lie when you tell it to deceive. duh. ------------------
RADIOACTIVE IE AHEAD! int name() |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
Dunno if you guys will ever agree on this, might be a bad idea for me to throw in my 2 cents, but what the heck. I think the fuss about fiction movies and books(like DV Code) is pretty stupid and is just drumming up sales for the writers of that fiction. OTOH, I think the writers have inserted certain themes in those stories that go along with their viewpoint to maybe change other people's opinion. Whether or not that works is debatable, but I won't let it stop me from enjoying a good movie. Or maybe that is just what they wrote into the story to make it interesting, who knows? I don't think any of us can figure that out atm, so arguing about it and calling eachother names and <crapola> probably isn't going to help . But who am I to be giving advice when I just had a big argument with somebody else over something equally picayune. So if you don't like it or something, by all means carry on . Lazarus |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
buddboy Lack of communication as always lol. For example you have childrens stories that have talking animals. But they try to teach kids things right? Fiction is used to make a point. It was used to educate, now it is used for persuade more than educate. You say Christianity persuades but it educates. In what they do now its 1/2 truths and Christianity is 100% truth if you say you are Christian and look at the facts that the more education people have the more they agree with it. It is one thing to talk about and another thing to persuade. Stories are to help teach moral values, but now they teach that everything is good. Most of the Hollywood films say mostly non Christian views. The fact is that1+1=2 but secular society says 1+1=whatever you want it to be even if you dont agree with what the other says which is insanity. Christianity limits certain freedom so that people have true freedom. Unlike secular views that say that people should be free to do everything but they dont say the consequences on themselves and imposed on others. We are not hippies to say free love, Christianity is against it since it how the consequences. Bad thing are more addicting than good. Something pure is not simple to obtain but something dirty is. Its easy to dirty clean water but hard to make clean dirty water. Again "if you mix **** with ice-cream you only ruin the ice-cream", but someone like cheesestorm that says " if you perceive the X-Men as a threat to your faith, that's your problem" which contradicts logic since is a drop of mud better are more pure than water and if so thats our problem since then water is not worth it since people can't handle it. Well thats a secular view for you to love drinking dirty water or having other impure things. But in today's society it's not a drop of mud but a cup full that goes into your drinking water, and you have people that tell you that if you can't handle the dirty water then the clean water is not good enough for you. The bad thing is that Christians embrace what is wrong and support it. Laz ------------------ [This message has been edited by warsong (edited June 21, 2006).] |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
Hm, I feel bad for posting after I said I'd stop. Somehow I don't think your lies trouble you as much. Yet, I am the immoral atheist.quote: quote: False x 2. quote: Lol, let me try again: If you perceive the X-Men as a threat to your faith, that's your problem. I agree with you that fiction can be used to brainwash people. I just don't see that happening with the X-Men. I think it's just saying that power is used for good or evil depending on who has it. We should support those who are different, when they use their differences to help others. [This message has been edited by CheeseStorm (edited June 22, 2006).] |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
Cheese I knew you would reply Just because you dont agree since you dont understand doesnt mean its a lie. I didnt say you are an immoral atheist, and you should stop thinking negative. The 2 thing you quotes and say are false are true, but that you dont want to believe it. Which is why you have another views and if you didnt then you would not say that. You have to admit that a secular society is pushing for a whatever you want it to be mentality. It encourages people to embrace something unnatural and illogical. For example the feminist movement in how women are taught that they all can be like men, and like gay marriages but can't give birth naturaly. If women want equality they should fight in the boxing ring with a man, or go to the front line and carry 100 pounds of gear and weapon, same sex marriages, etc. Everyone has their role but the secular view want blur the lines. If you think something pure and good is bad then Which metaphor seems more logical? I get the feeling you wont get it lol. Look at you, you think you are so strong that you think you are super man but yet you talk like a person that has been affected as in case one to think that you can drink bad water. If you and everyone can swallow example #1 then I will agree with you. Sure x-men has some good points in what you said to use your power for good, but you can not deny that it has many other messages besides that, which is why I said before it brings in truths to persuade people in other ideologies. When society forgets the original meaning of things and embraces the twisted view of it then it shows that it has problems. Pretend you are my lawyer and you have to defend my side, so you should know the other side better than they know it and when you do then you can weigh which side gets it. Society needs atheists since they are easier to control to sell products to that perfect materialistic consumer which is why it pushes for it, and as the bible says the root to all evil is money since many will do anything for money. ------------------ |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
Lol, my Dad is sorta like warsong. He actually thinks Walker, Texas Ranger is a bad show and Chuck Norris is an angel of light like Lucifer, disguised as something good but really something bad. Whatever... it's a shame tho', I miss hearing that sound, dunno how you'd describe it , as Walker kicks somebody unconcious . Lazarus |
|
NetCog Member Posts: 149 From: Registered: 06-15-2006 |
quote: Wrong! It is the LOVE of money that is the root of all evil. I'd quote a verse but there's more than one underscoring the "love of money" not money itself.
Just like the often misrepresented evil of "money" vs "love of money"... quote: Do I believe "fiction" is evil or wrong? I don't know. The Bible has indications that it, like a handful of things, aren't inherently a sin - either by reference or omission (as far as I am aware). But it's indications, not clear like murder, theft, or rape is wrong (I don't think...). Am I concerned for my eternal place in Heaven because of "fiction"? Hardly. The indications of "fiction" being a sin or not are potentially clearer than some other unknown or gray areas...but in that clarity resides the unknown - for me. If all fiction is defined as lies then fiction is a sin because lies are sinful. I'm resting on relating "fiction" to that of "eating meat" and the "Intent" or circumstances of either to define the sinful or neutral nature of those actions. The only sin that could affect me and my eternal nature is the one of rejection of Christ...something I've already dealt with. The rest are details that pertain to my relationship with God and those around me. I also find it difficult to believe all fiction as lies as sin when many people have been given or have developed imagination and talents in the 'arts' of written and artistic (draw, paint, sculpt) expression. However ultimately flawed it is, a logical case could be convincingly made to prove any artistic impression beyond that of historical documentation (or advice, or opinion notated as such) in written or graphical form which conveys an actual picture or series of events would be fiction thus lies. That everyone should be devoted only to production of goods or services directly, specifically, and utilitarian-ly relating to food, shelter, and clothing or working in support of such activities (financial services) is not what I think this life is solely about while we learn more of God and His plan for us. That seems too much like worker bees, and while we have a sin nature to distract us, we also have reason and imagination as gifts from God. Ultimately, those trains of thought probably fall under a similar point as discussing "endless genealogies".... though that brings up 1st Timothy 1: quote: I have a feeling that passage still doesn't resolve "fiction" issue as I bet there is more to the story when you (A) study the context, (B) get the original Greek(?), and (C) bring in any other letters or books containing relevant material.
[This message has been edited by NetCog (edited June 22, 2006).] |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
quote: So, you admit that atheists have morals? That would be a positive thought!
quote: How would you feel if I said something like "Christianity is poisoning our water."? Even as a metaphor, I think it would be unacceptable.
quote: Let me make my stance more clear: I don't care about feminism or gay rights. Why? Even if I think it's gross, it's not harming anyone. If bad mutants use their powers for evil, it doesn't mean all mutants should be imprisoned.
quote: Atheists buy just as much junk as everyone else. |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
Laz Sort of? Lol I never saw that show, I only seen the commercials of Walker, Texas Ranger. Netcog Cheese Non Christian views poison, and you can see things not by its words but by its actions. Secular views have made things worse in the US since divorce rates are higher; more people unhealthy, people own more, STD increased, etc. The country was founded on Christian values and even George Washington says for this country to do well it needs people to be Christians. The point of the metaphor was to state about how something pure is harder to obtain. As the bible says the wide, short, easy path is the wrong path. You say that you don't care and that those like feminism gay rights don't harm anyone but the facts are that they do which is the whole point and they try to impose it on others. Even the bible is considered bad to some gays and is pushing for things to ban it. Which is why their are sects that make their own version and say they are Christian but are not and do bad things to Christians and non Christians like to turn them off, but you seem to encourage that type of secularization in a way, but you might come back and object and I might have to show another example lol. After the womens movement everyone has been affected and things went down will. If you think it doesn't affect read the other side that the liberal media doesnt say since they want their side of the story . The thing with you is that you think you know enough to grasp what is going but you don't. Even Socrates which was one of the smartest men of all time said all he knows is that he knows nothing. He is humble just like how Christianity says to be humble and keep looking for answers. Atheist do buy as much as everyone else but more. A real Christian doesn't do a lot of what secular people do and the ones that do have been influenced by secular views and the other Christians sects bow down to cater to society to buy the junk. You dont know what a real Christian is yet and you mix everything. Even Socrates when he went to the market said that he saw so many things that he didnt need. If you look hard enough you will see that secular people buy more junk for hedonistic pleasure while a real Christian buys what he needs for joy. Everything to moderation, unlike Las Vegas (sin city) is doing well since it thrives on secular people to see its products. Gambling is a sin and the government is making a lot from it. Christians should fast but more secularized Christian sects dont do which is good for companies. The list goes on. Remember in pool you hit another ball so that it hits the ball you want, so dont expect secularists to give you the answers since they wont. ------------------ |
|
NetCog Member Posts: 149 From: Registered: 06-15-2006 |
quote: That might be. But then there are people who do "know better" yet do it anyways. Ignorance isn't the "root". The old sin nature is. If we are discussing on your references (and without consulting Scripture at this point), if anything it's "arrogance" which is the root. Arrogance that "my" way is more important than "God's" way. (And I think Scripture would support that - what with the examples of Lucifer's rebellion and Adam and Eve's rebellion.) "Real Christian". Define "real". The drunkard on the street who is jobless, homeless, and listless who at one time walked through the doors of a church or heard someone speaking, recognized himself for the sinner that he was/is, realized he couldn't get There on his own, and recieved Christ as his Savior is no more or less a "real christian" than someone who goes to church every 2nd or 3rd day, prays and reads his Bible 45 minutes every morning and night, and is at peace with everyone they encounter. There is no "act" that is "better", there is no "act" that is "worse", done by one who is saved, which makes that one any more or less "really saved" than their saved neighbor. It. Is. Not. About. Following. The. Law. I hesitate referencing this without additional passages as many of the other verses are used incorrectly but Luke 18 is pretty clear about the law issue. 1st Timothy 6 provides additional reference for some issues brought up in Luke 18, 2nd Timothy 2 also provides additional reference for some side issues brought up by the earlier passages....I could probably go on but I'll stop here.
[This message has been edited by NetCog (edited June 24, 2006).] |
|
CheeseStorm Member Posts: 521 From: Registered: 11-28-2004 |
On the topic of buying junk, there is no difference between real Christians, real Buddhists, real Taoists, sensible atheists, etc. The average person (Christian, Buddhist, whatever) will try to buy happiness even if they know it's impossible. I wonder why the great spiritual "leaders" don't live in simple houses. TV commercials are mostly aimed at stupid people who can't think for themselves. Like you said, actions speak louder than words. It doesn't matter what religion they say they are because they're still going to buy a $70,000 truck to pick up groceries once a week. Destroying the love for money can not be done by religion alone because it is up to the people themselves. If they really want to follow religion (or if they're sensible enough to have "common sense"), they can get rid of their addictions. But as Morpheus says in the Matrix, "You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it." So let's work together and think of solutions. If they followed their religions they wouldn't be buying this junk, but they only follow their addictions. My solution is to remind them that any day could be their last! If that doesn't motivate them, then I don't know what will. Not counting Hell, cause I don't believe in it. ^_^ You're right about feminism, it does slow progress. [This message has been edited by CheeseStorm (edited June 24, 2006).] |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
I don't usually get into this, but in reply to Warsong's post and in agreement with Netcog, weren't Adam and Eve innocent when they were ignorant? If ignorance is evil then why did evil come into man when they weren't ignorant of evil anymore? Just an honest question, for Warsong. ------------------ [This message has been edited by lava (edited June 24, 2006).] |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
oooh... nice point lava... i don't even want to get into these arguments anymore, for one reason, what is teh point? plus i don't have the energy to read all these long posts.. ------------------
RADIOACTIVE IE AHEAD! int name() |
|
CapnStank Member Posts: 214 From: Sask, Canada Registered: 12-16-2004 |
Budd: The point? Waste time perhaps? I don't think there is a real point to this all. One thing that we have a habit of doing here is generalizing people, Christians, Athiests, etc. We look at them as if the majority who are clueless and blindly follow their claims aren't the best example of those paradigms or points of view. Be honest here, there is a LOT of "Christians" you know who blindly follow the faith but no clue why. Have they taken the time to step back and look at why they're religious? When Cheese and I look at general Christians this is who we see, I admit (but then again I shouldn't speak on Cheese's behalf). When you speak of Atheists you see "immoral" "greedy" "stupid". Which, by the way, is actually very stereotypical. Our arguements usuaally end no where because of this I believe. But back to the topic at hand... Like Cheese said, the fact that you're Christian won't make anything snap in your head saying, oh, I shouldn't buy this. It's you making the decision, just the same as an athiest can say that. Sure the Bible may preech the idea of being free from material desire, but I understand that concept and heck, I didn't need a book to tell me that. There are both intelligent Christians and intelligent Athiests, but we got to learn that being religious doesn't effect you in any way besides being religous. I've stated many times (it's pretty hard to prove over a forum) that I live my life very well, I assist others when needed, and am never afraid to speak up for what I feel is right. I'm not greedy, or stupid, and that in no way is effected by my 'religion.' So could we please leave the idea that your faith is somehow connected to your character elsewhere? EDIT: Woot, page 2! ------------------ [This message has been edited by CapnStank (edited June 24, 2006).] |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
thank you CapnStank, my point exactly. there is no point, unless you just like wasting your time. which i believe was discussed in another topic, saying that playing games is a waste of time. well, this is. so i think i'm gonna go play a game. =D ------------------
RADIOACTIVE IE AHEAD! int name() |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
netcog Ignorance leads to sin. Since if they knew the consequences then they would stop. No man would do evil if they knew what evil really is. We all lack the insight of the great philosophers before Christ since we pick up barbaric views and teat good and bad equality without thinking it out well. You can see lack of information when atheists ask simple questions but think they know the hardest questions. Cheese The founding fathers knew that to have a better society people have to be Christian and they based their views on Christian and Ancient Greek views since they knew it was similar. Many people down south agree which is why they made their own Parthenon to show respect to them since some say to be american you have to be Greek/christian, but now we mix and put things that go againt it to contradict and pass it off as good which is insane. Every other culture is just the bread crumbs of those and they have some good points because of its origins. Now society pushes away form it and people wonder why they have so many problems and only look at the technological advancements in progress while most things are degraded. That is what happens when people do not know history. Lava Capnstank I agree if a little in your point about atheists lol The greate4st minds were the ancient Greeks which helped influence Christianity so are they stupid, immoral, greedy etc like their counterparts of the time like the Persians, Jews, and other tribes that live in tents? Secularists attack Christianity for not being scientific but they should look at themselves since they say everyone is equal like sexes for example which go against general biology. If they are not stupid then maybe evil since they intentionally do that. Toilets have been invented 2000 years ago by the people that acted Christian like but this is a new concept to people today. Even Christians diluted their faith for secular views and act without morals which even the immoral people of old times had more morals than many Christians do today. Many Christians are Christians by word than by actions. Obviously both religious and non religion will buy junk but more likely people that lean away from their religious beliefs. Even Socrates was not a Christians since Christ was not around then but many say he was a Christian in his actions, and when he went to the market he said he never saw so many things that he didnt want, but in todays society people feel they never saw so much that they want. Logic = Ancient Greek thinkers = Christianity and the founding fathers knew this and this information is not taught now to embrace what is wrong and people get wrong ideas and pass it off as good. Its like mixing perfection with imperfection into one (mix black and white to be gray) and some point out some good things in the imperfection (in the gray) obviously. When you mix **** with Ice-cream you only ruin the ice-cream. Buddboy ------------------ |
|
NetCog Member Posts: 149 From: Registered: 06-15-2006 |
quote: wow...just wow... Point 1. Adam and Eve were created perfect. To assume they were not perfect mentally is to assume a defect in God's initial unspoiled creation. quote: quote:
The story of the Old Testament is rife with examples of people knowing what they should do and what they shouldn't do but doing their own thing anyways. Saul...David...Solomon...Samson...Moses...the Israelites in the wilderness...shall I keep going? The news today is filled with the exact same thing. Shoot...Lucifer was top dog of the angels and even he rebelled. Who better to know God and to know what God considers right and wrong than the guy who stands behind the throne of heaven? Not to mention the third that followed Lucifer.
quote:
quote: Please tell me you've never been around kids. Because if you had, you'd know that 2nd sentence is a bald-faced lie. Please, on what basis you believe the 3rd sentence to be true? [This message has been edited by NetCog (edited June 28, 2006).] |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
netcog Perfection is perfection, it does not error. If they were truly perfect they would be God. Lets not deal with just words we see since many ignore the logic. Ignorance is the lack of information to be logical, logic is Christian views, and lack of logic is further away form Christian view which leads to sin. Try to pull that stunt in society and use the excuse that you didnt know that law and the judge will tell you that you should have known it. But your honor I didnt know robbing was against the law I didnt see a sign that it was bad lol Here is a true story. ------------------ |
|
NetCog Member Posts: 149 From: Registered: 06-15-2006 |
I was mistaken in my use of Perfect with regards to Adam and Eve. Replace "perfect" with "good". The point still stands. ~ Adam and Woman were not morons. ~ They had far more exposure to God (in Eden) than we do (face to face anyways). ~ They made their choice not from ignorance but out of choosing to go against God's decree. To assume that with more "intelligence" they would have stopped and thought things through is to assume the higher the IQ (or whatever) the less you will sin. Even if we limit that assumption to those with high IQ (whatever) and who are Christian, that is still a lie. It is perpetuating the lie that Satan told Woman. I will not debate the merits of "logic" as a concept. The truth of "logic" as a concept is that one can factually logically come to a wrong conclusion. I can "prove" anything with some scraps of "fact" and a good dose of logic. And leaving it in the hands of "logic" is 'debating' on the wrong level. Because then you have to define whose logic is "best", which brings you back to faith and God which you might as well have started there in the first place. Logic or reason is only one of the handful of evidences we have at our disposal, it is not the magic yard stick. Yes I have heard of the story. The "excuse" of sin to be purely ignorance is a falsehood. There is no ignorance of God and of his Creation. There is no ignorance of salvation even if one has not heard the name of Christ - for two reasons: 1. Creation dictates that God exists, 2. God is faithful. Should I never hear the name of Christ yet I believe that God is God and I am man and sinful and there is no method of work that I may be with God, I will be saved. Yet God is God and should I require to hear the name of Jesus and thus then be saved, I will. Unlike our court system where "ignorance" of the evidence might or might not be a valid defense and independently might or might not adjust the penalty, the evidence of God's creation is inherent in each one of us. To deny the evidence and produce an argument of "ignorance" is to proclaim our "arrogence" and to be blind to His handiwork. To make that claim is to say, "I see Creation but it is not enough, I demand more. Prove yourself to me God." Though He has already "proven" himself. I think something needs to be clarified (for myself included) [This message has been edited by NetCog (edited June 29, 2006).] |
|
Posts: From: Registered: |
Do you know how Domino or billiards works? It causes a chain reaction but you should know the source of it. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Evil Only a fool will choose evil and a fool is not known for their brain since they lack it when they act like fools. What you say goes against logic if you step back and loot at it as a whole. I am not saying to have a high IQ will prevent you from doing sin since being smart is not just having a high IQ on certain aspects and not on others. People are inherently evil but if you look closely the bible (NT) is truth since its logical and the apostles lives mostly in Ancient Greece which they were known for logic and inspired Christianity. So it seems that the more knowledge the less evil they did and money was not the issue since there were no homeless people back then (as we have today) and only rich people paid taxes because they wanted to give to get honor, fame, etc. Kind of like how some churches are run when people give money and their names are mentioned. Things flourished which benefited us all now and we take for granted the information and people embrace the opposite and wonder why there is poverty, crime, diseases, homelessness, immorality, etc. The love of money is from the ignorance to not know the consequences. And not to the ignorance Money and ignorance can be used as tools, but the most powerful one is ignorance. But if you had to pick something material by people then ignorance doesnt count. When you are the richest person like bill gates that gives away money like water its ignorance the makes him sin as I stated in the other post. I also like this saying by Edmund Burke: All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing. ------------------ |