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I found this online by accident but it is interesting in a way which I get 1/2 of what it says. I saw page 19-21 It keeps comparing science and religion as one in a way. The site talks a bit strange but maybe some might find it interesting. http://www.valuelogicmaths.com/Faith_Reason.pdf |
bennythebear Member Posts: 1225 From: kentucky,usa Registered: 12-13-2003 |
. ------------------ www.gfa.org - Gospel for Asia www.persecution.com - Voice of the Martyrs |
CoolJ Member Posts: 354 From: ny Registered: 07-11-2004 |
Dude, that stuff is whacked! New Age rationalization of God, science, technology, phenomenon,etc.. Whoever wrote or compiled that stuff needs to stick with the Bible. You can get to thinking some pretty messed up things by attempting to force human reason into God's word. I remember once an athiest friend asked 'What kind of God would allow people to suffer, if Jesus came to earth and was able to heal people, why didn't he teach people, or give humans the power to heal each other, so there wouldn't be suffering or death' I told him 'knowing how human nature is and people are, do you really think if God gave us (all) the power to heal, you think this would be a good thing? This wouldn't be used only for good, but for great evil. Imaging, people knowing they could do anything, and suffer no consequences. Rob a bank, get shot, no problem, have a friend heal you or heal yourself. It would be like Highlander and the immortals. Not too pretty.' |
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bennythebear Member Posts: 1225 From: kentucky,usa Registered: 12-13-2003 |
very true. there's a reason we have to go through God for healings, one being the reason you stated. and another is God deserves the glory. human logic = crap. i know, i understood the all worldly wisdom by the time i was 14, then i got Jesus and realized how empty that crap is, and i do mean crap, dung, well...anything that can lead or keep people from God is dung. ------------------ www.gfa.org - Gospel for Asia www.persecution.com - Voice of the Martyrs |
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
logically speaking, human logic is severly limited. ------------------ |
Simon_Templar Member Posts: 330 From: Eau Claire, WI USA Registered: 10-25-2004 |
reason and logic are good things. God made us reasonable, and logical.. in fact Christ is the Logos (Word, but also the root of logic). Faith is superior to reason, in that reason must be founded on faith, or it becomes unreasonable ------------------ |
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ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
well, look at it this way, you can NEVER prove anything true. think about it, everything we know are probabilities of truth, and but not PROVEN true. ------------------ |
HanClinto Administrator Posts: 1828 From: Indiana Registered: 10-11-2004 |
The links no longer work for me, but fwiw, something that I heard that seems to be a good working definition is "faith is trusting in the evidence". At least in my own Christian walk, that's very true. Respectfully, |
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Simon_Templar Member Posts: 330 From: Eau Claire, WI USA Registered: 10-25-2004 |
well, the problem is that proof is a somewhat subjective word. I believe things can be proven. However, it is always possible to doubt, its just that some times doubt (or scepticism) is taken to rediculous lengths. ------------------ |
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ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
how can you prove something? by science? no... science is about disproving possibilites. you cannot disprove every possibility, but you can find a extremely high probablity that something is true. ------------------ |
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Simon_Templar Member Posts: 330 From: Eau Claire, WI USA Registered: 10-25-2004 |
ultimately all knowledge is based on some kind of faith, no matter how elementary. However, there are many things which are known with such certainty that it is considered either insane or lunacy to doubt them. The sun rises in the east and sets in the west, rivers flow down hill.. observations of natural reality depend on faith in your senses... believing that when you see or feel something it is really there and is how you persieve it to be. simply put, faith that your sensory perception is reliable. This can be doubted, but only an idiot or an insane person really truly doubts it. once things like that are known, or 'proven' they can, in turn, be used to prove other things by chains of logical reasoning (called a syllogism in logic). I know that rivers run down hill, to run down hills is to move from an elevated position to a less elevated position through a channel which enables passage. thus if I take water and elevate it, provide a channel for it to run through, it will flow to a the lowest elevation possible. The reason skepticism is nearly impossible to defeat in logical debate is because all knowledge (which forms the premises of any argument) rest upon assumptions(faith) and all one needs to do is find a way to question the basic assumption and doubt it. The problem of course is that skepticism produces horribly unreasonable results that only an idiot would really believe. That is why reason without faith is unreasonable. ------------------ |
I like to say God gave us reason to guard against blind faith, and he gave us faith to guard against blind reason.