Klumsy Administrator Posts: 1061 From: Port Angeles, WA, USA Registered: 10-25-2001 |
hehe,quote: let the language flamewars begin.. actually from my benchmarking, project management timecycle analsysis, comparision of debugging , the amount of bugs with large scale projects.. i've found C++ to be a very expensive way to develop software that doesn't need high level speed issues.. even with the best C++ developers.. the lagnauge is quite old now... features such as interfaces and many new development aspects are kind of just hacked on (well in the case of Microsoft Visual C++, however MS has all the header files for everything so thats a bonus, also MSVC++ is very slow.. C++ in general got 'cross platform' compatibility (if you design your stuff right)... MSVC++ IS a relatively optmizing compiler (almost as good as delphi).. for a windows langauge, i'd choose delphi, for speed of developing, well designed classes, well designed OO langauge (better than C++ , obviously because its much newer), better development enviroment, and better support groups and forums on the net (opinion here).. it allows you to implement stuff from high level VB sort of basic stuff, down to core system level and has an awesome build in assembler... for windows stuff i believe its the best in most cases.. also making windows/linux stuff,, combination of delphi and kylix kick butt.. however it doesn't have such a widely supported user base as C++, and that is the main feature.. myself like C syntax i miss stuff like variable++ in delphi... but having a C++ background. i prefer delphi, but also in the real world i'd suggest C++ for game development.. (maybe not for learning)... i can't stand how slow msvc++ takes to compile large projects... C++ is a good language for its day.. new development paradigms however have been hacked on rather awkwardly and unintuitively. there is 2 cents of my $100 i know some of it is bias.. and my philosophy is 'the best tool for the job'.. sometimes even VB is that case (given the resources, if your app doesn't need to accomplish much , and your resources are professional 'amatuer programmers' who only have VB experience, then go VB, and cry the whole way.. ------------------ |
|
MeanManInOz Member Posts: 388 From: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia Registered: 06-26-2001 |
Gosh, I was half kidding and didn't expect a reply.
quote: Everything M$ add to the language is hacked on, but apart from Windowing, most of it can be done using the standard library, for example I live in horror of people who use CArray and CList.
quote: This is where I strongly disagree. The reason C++ is a hard beginner language is because it is taught wrong. Students should be exposed to std::String before char *, for instance, and then allowed to 'discover' more advanced features as they learn.
quote: No argument there.
quote: Now THIS is blasphemy !!! What do you think is hacked on ? The new C++ standard is underway, and C++ is very much an alive language.
quote: *grin* |
|
Gift Member Posts: 85 From: Palatine, IL, USA Registered: 02-11-2001 |
Your both wrong if I were to speak in some strange tounge it would be National Instruments LabVIEW real strange because its pictures. Nothing can beat that for development time or minimizing the amount of bugs while developementing for engineering problems. zero spelling errors, zero syntax errors, it interfaces easily with other powerful tools like MATLAB and .dll's, the coolest thing is that it is graphical/iconic you can just look at it and you know whats going on. For instance yesterday I drew some code to interface with USGS Elevation data for every kilometer of the earth unzips the data reads it to 2d array and downsamples all the data then zips it and reads the next block, but the data is in blocks so I also have to reassemble it, some guy was charging for the same data $2500 now thats some money i'm saveing, I hope to post my first milestone in the downloads section. Love in Christ [This message has been edited by Gift (edited March 03, 2002).] |
baltasar Junior Member Posts: 9 From: Torshavn, Faroe Islands Registered: 03-02-2002 |
Ok, mabey I am new here, and I do not know much about what you are talking about, just a little.  I will just give a small comment and mabey get some feedback about what I am going to say.  Now'a'days alot is happening on the developement scene, and the future spells 3D and more 3D. My question is, what language is best to use, when it comes to 3D games? I know that there are what the professionals call, 3D Engines, such as a Quake engine or another engine. How does these engines work together with f.ex. C++ or Delphi? As I was saying, alot is happening on the developement scene, and in the last 2 or 3 years I have seen new languages pop up, such as DarkBasic (A BASIC language to create 3D games with.), Blitz-Basic 3D (Another BASIC language to create 3D games with.) and the newest (I think...) which is called JAMAGIC (An object orientated language to create 3D games with. It looks like mixture of JAVA and C++ in many ways.) How about these new languages, are they just short living languages or is there a future in them? (I think there is a future in them, because they are very user friendly.) What do you say, who have been into the programming business for many years? Is these languages worth it or not? ------------------ |
D-SIPL Moderator Posts: 1345 From: Maesteg, Wales Registered: 07-21-2001 |
If your serious about game programming then c/c++. Languages like Blitz Basic, Dark Basic, will limit you on a professional level. I am a Java programmer, i have also been learning, using C/C++ for about 2 years now. I have realised, that if i want my games to look, feel professional then i need to use c/c++. This is my personal opinion, i have never used blitz basic or any of the many variants so i can only comment on what i have seen. Anyways God Bless you all!! --D-SIPL |
|
MadProf Member Posts: 181 From: Larnaka, Cyprus Registered: 01-24-2001 |
it all depends at what stage you are at, programmingly, and what you want to do, on a long term and short term basis. if you are new to developing, then BlitzBasic or DarkBasic might be a good idea, as they can teach you a lot of basic programming skills which (if you learn them) can be transferred easily to other languages. Basic things such as collision detection, Score boards, etc, can often be "planned" out easily in an "easy" language, such as BB, DB, etc. If you have done 3d art, and want to learn 3d game writing, then using [a href="http://www.blender.nl"]blender[/a] might be a good plan, because it comes from a (brilliant, free) 3d production suite, and has added game writing facilities, with point and click programming, as well as python scripting. If you know some about programming already, of have done a lot of C/C++ before, but no game writing, then obviously, learning BB or DB or blender will not help much, because you are used to writing C, and so just getting hold of decent game writing documentation and working from that is good. However.... seeing how BB is free download, and comes with a lot of example code and such, downloading it and playing around, just to see how they do things, might be a good idea. MeanMan: About C++ being hard etc... I tried to learn C++ a few years ago, using a learning book for the C++ 2.0 spec, which is quite old now MadProf PS - Of courese, this is all *my* personal biased arogant opinion ------------------ |
Revelator Member Posts: 226 From: Sydney, NSW, Australia Registered: 03-22-2001 |
I am working with BlitzBasic, basically because I tried C++ and could learn the language pretty well, but getting DirectX up and running was a real pain in the rear. I managed basic graphics OK, but couldn't get the sound to work. So BlitzBasic is where I am at this stage. If I make a really good game, then i will consider porting it over to C++. Plus, not having much money - Blitz is a good option. (2d version anyway.) By the way, I think 3d games are overated. I prefer 2d rpg games. Revelator! ------------------ |
|
Klumsy Administrator Posts: 1061 From: Port Angeles, WA, USA Registered: 10-25-2001 |
the only thing i think could be a prob which such languages is there maybe some restrictions on scaling.. i.e if you have a big world.. can you program and move memory and stuff around enough to have it run fast enough but for a run of a mill 2d rpg on todays machines thats probably not even an issue even if you were making a javascript rpg  you are write, trying to get the overhead of getting DX running well, and on every card is a bit of a pain, you just wanna make the game.. as for music./sound. DX has much to be desired... but there are many good libraries out there like FMOD.. very soon we'll release an alpha of our demosystem that rowan has been making.. its not really suitible for making games.. (well i suppose it could be adapted)... but basically we have made a system that deals with the initiation and graphics of dx, and also music and sound.. rowan is currently implementing a common way to manage Zbuffers, a colorbuffers and stencilbuffers etc ------------------ |
