Word was................Y
Word was with God.......H
Word was a God..........V
Word was with God.......H

What is the Word? Is it the sacred name of God?

Why are there 4 days in the first chapter?

Why every 4 chaps is there a story about a woman?

Best wishes,

St. Cheez

Once again you are talking about things that aren't there.

Where does it mention "days" in John 1?
And the Y..H..V..H?????

The first few verses of John tell us that Jesus was with God the Father right in the beginning and was instrumental in creating this earth.

And about every four chapters having a story of a woman in it...
The people who wrote the gospels did not have any punctuation (not even spaces between words) let alone chapters. Chapters were added much later to the New Testament. So it wasn't anything that the writer of the gospel planned, so therefore the point is only a piece of trivia.

The reason why I find this kind of information uninteresting is that my faith is based on what the Bible says. If my faith is based on a Bible which can be interpreted any which way, then I might as well forget about being a Christian.

Because then maybe the resurrection did not take place, but was just a spiritual metaphor of a new birth into the fourth dimension anticipating the eschaton.

Revelator!

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www.revelatorgames.com

cheez, the only reason i can see why you would be looking for "hidden meanings" in the Bible, is because you see no meaning to the storys, because there illogical. This is because God talks by his Spirit, and if your not reading it in the Spirit, you will get little to nothing. If i were you, i'd get to know God, and then ask him what it means. He'll tell ya. Try it out.

-Veritech

"Where does it mention "days" in John 1?
And the Y..H..V..H?????"

Well, in the first chapter, it mentions that this happens on the first day, that on the second day, etc. It really does, if you take the trouble to read it. I tend to read and question everything so as to not miss the message. I speculated that YHSVH may have been prophetic. He saw the properous Israel under the tree 2 days or 2,000 years earlier. This might even indicate a hint of the second coming, but again I am just speculating.

"The first few verses of John tell us that Jesus was with God the Father right in the beginning and was instrumental in creating this earth."

Sounds right to me.

"And about every four chapters having a story of a woman in it...
The people who wrote the gospels did not have any punctuation (not even spaces between words) let alone chapters. Chapters were added much later to the New Testament. So it wasn't anything that the writer of the gospel planned, so therefore the point is only a piece of trivia."

Well, for sure the Hebrew has no punctuation and can be read both forwards and backwards. I know of two Jews who are translating it backwards, which I found interesting. Even if the Greek had no punctuation or chapters, the present order of the book is rather interesting to me. However, if there is a reason for this order, then I am obliged to seek the message, even if I do not understand it at first glance. (To say the gospel was not planned is your opinion which is about as good as mine).

"The reason why I find this kind of information uninteresting is that my faith is based on what the Bible says. If my faith is based on a Bible which can be interpreted any which way, then I might as well forget about being a Christian."

UNINTERESTING... well, I find the book interesting. This reminds me of a well-known Christian speaker on the radio who disliked John, because it was for weak Christians. He considered himself strong, therefore preferred the first book. Each to his own I suppose.

As I understand it, when a person reads, he interprets or thinks. He either interprets correctly or incorrectly. I personally find it difficult to read and not think. Thinking should not contradict faith but rather strengthen it. Oh, and, thinking should not hinder a person from continuing to be a Christian. It should actually help.

"Because then maybe the resurrection did not take place, but was just a spiritual metaphor of a new birth into the fourth dimension anticipating the eschaton."

Yup, I think some so-called Christains did teach that once. However, I do not believe I ever mentioned this in my post thus consider it a getting-off-topic or at the least a weak argument. As you may have noticed, I never made any dogmatic statements but rather just asked questions? Maybe you may have intrepreted more in the questions than I actually stated.

Best wishes,

St. Cheez

Actually, Veritech, I did ask God and believe that I was taught by the Holy Spirit. However, I prefer not to preach in a dogmatic manner to fellow Christians. Its better that they learn for themselves.

The message that I got was that everything originates in heaven and comes from God alone; that even though the spirit is unseen, its greater than the seen which is earthly world. Theres more to it than this, but John is rather involved.

We all have free will. No one in all fairness should believe what I say. If the food which I am presenting is undigestible, then the person should stick to the food to which they are familiar.

Best wishes,

St. Cheez

Best wishes,

St. Cheez

Yes, you were not dogmatic about anything and are just speculating.
I was just giving an illustration of where speculating can lead you (ie. what the ressurection can mean if you keep speculating)

You are on a different wavelength than me in regard to understanding the Bible.

Have fun.

Revelator!

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www.revelatorgames.com

Yup, I am definitely on a differently wavelength. I think that there is a message in John if people are interested in hearing it. In my opinion, one way to look at it differently is to focus your attention on the female disciples in the story and see if anything comes to you. If I remember correctly, it stated that the Holy Spirit was neither recognized nor accepted, that everything we knew about the Holy Spirit was wrong or maybe misunderstood. To this day, many male elders of the church have not accepted the Father, Son, Holy Spirit teachings of YHSVH and in particular the Holy Spirit. Well, for the sake of discussion, if we are living near the end of this age, then discussion of the Holy Spirit may be very important. Well, thats my opinion for what it is worth.

Concerning free-will and free-thought, you will not read anything of it in the Bible exactly. However, YHSVH may have showed it in his actions and words. Note that he always ask the person what he thought or believed. I do not believe he gave people a hard time with their answers. In rare cases, he gave a direct answer like when he talked to the woman at the well. He also told Peter to get out of his way. Peter selfishly wanted YHSVH (like many others) to do what he wanted YHSVH to do, and YHSVH wanted to do what he had to do.

If YHSVH did not believe in free will or free thought, he most likely would have told people directly how they should feel and think. However, this is kind of self defeating. If God had to force people to love Him, it would not make much sense. Would it? If a person is forced to believe in your faith, then the conversion is not real. Is it?

Anyway, I am thankful that we all do not think exactly alike, and that there is always something new to learn in life. I am almost certain you have never heard a Sunday school lesson like this before, and probably for good reasons.

Best wishes,

Rudy

[This message has been edited by Saint Cheez (edited June 25, 2001).]

However, it isn't each to his own. What matters is what's true and what isn't. It's not "This is true for you, but not for me." It's either right, or it's wrong. So yeah, it's definetly good to have these discussions. It helps us sort out, well, what's true and what isn't.

By the way Rudy, you say to look at the scriptures for yourself, but, you don't give any references. It would be helpful if you showed us where in the scriptures your point is proved. It's easier than making us read the entire book of John all over again just to find one thing.

†Caleb†

PS: Sorry for the slow response, I've been busy lately.

I don't want anyone to think that I'm saying that people aren't entitled to their own opinion about certain things. I'm just saying that things are pretty solid for the most part when it comes to what the Bible shows is true. Don't think I'm saying that you're wrong if you don't like french fries and I do (just to give a crazy example).

†Caleb†

If I remember correctly, YHSVH asked people questions, then listened to their answers. One of Peters answers was approved by YHSVH. However, when YHSVH did make personal, direct statements, the church of his time had him killed. He may have lost most of his disciplines, when he made the statement "drink my blood, eat my flesh". Many of them took him literally rather than spiritually. Some of things he stated in his time were rather controversial and even today many Christian's do not agree with everything he stated like for instance the "Trinity" doctrine. Yup, intolerance is a killer sometimes. Maybe this time people will actually see the "sun" rather than darkness, when they killed him.

Have people really changed all that much in 2,000 years? Did they really understand everything he tried to teach them? Probably not.

Anyone know why Catholics don't read the Bible? Apparently, many of the church leaders believed in certain gnostic beliefs even though they persecuted gnostic followers. It goes like this. Man fell because he desire knowledge of God. Desire to know was a sin. Therefore, man should not ask questions, desire knowledge of God. Funny though. The Catholic creed contain certain gnostic statements like "only begotten not made" stuff. Even though they destroyed the gnostic followers, they retained gnostic beliefs. Thats why Catholics do not read the Bible.

As YHVSH stated, the truth will set you free.

Thanks for you kind remarks which really were appreciated.

Best wishes,

St. Cheez