D-SIPL Moderator Posts: 1345 From: Maesteg, Wales Registered: 07-21-2001 |
Hey People, Firstly congrats again on taking part/supporting the first CCN Game Programming Competition! You really made it a success. This your place to give your suggestions/constructive criticism/rants about the competition. 1. Did you think 2 weeks was enough, too long or too short? 2. Did you like the theme? What themes would you like to see? 3. Were there enough prizes? What prixes would you like to see? (sensibles answers rather than 3DS Max etc etc) 4. What can we improve on or change?
------------------ |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
1. I thought it was a good amount of time, maybe 3 weeks would be good, but that sounds like it would be too long. 2.I was uncomfortable with the theme, because of the last chapter in Revelation. And I think if the themes were a little more unspecific it would be more interesting and produce more variety. 3. Well I didnt see any real prizes that interested me until Milkshape was offered, mainly because I already paid $100 for Blitz3D, when I could've just won DarkBasic here. I think stuff like modellors or games were great prizes. 4.Take less time to judge, haha jk. I can't think of anything right now, I think the other questions I answered covered it. ------------------ [This message has been edited by Lava (edited September 20, 2006).] |
steveth45 Member Posts: 536 From: Eugene, OR, USA Registered: 08-10-2005 |
I think two weeks was a decent amount of time for a speed game competition. We could have a non-speed game competition that's longer. Also, it could have been shorter, too. I kind of like the idea of the weekend competition. No, I didn't like the theme. Don't get me wrong, the book is fine, it's just a little overdone recently with LBG and others. There was about the right number of prizes. A note on that, the DarkBasic plugins should be given out with the DarkBasic Pro license to the same person otherwise somebody would have to buy DarkBasic Pro to use them. Milkshape is probably the most useful prize. If we get a lot more people involved next time, which I hope, we might want more prizes. The guys over at Retro Remakes had several thousand dollars worth of prizes, of course they had 76 entries, too. It was unclear if there was an overall winner category or not. It looked like there wasn't. I know pride is a sin, but a friendly competition is a friendly competition, and people want to win. Plus, the distribution of prizes among the winners of the various categories could have been set out ahead of time. ------------------ |
Jari Member Posts: 1471 From: Helsinki, Finland Registered: 03-11-2005 |
1) Two weeks was good amount of time for me since I used engine that I was familiar with. I wasn't able to finnish my game thought but that's just my own fault for trying to do something I shouldn't. But some people didn't have much time from their daily schedule so it wasn't enough for them. Which is why I don't like these time limits at all, actually. 2) The theme was great! I really enjoyed reading revelations and studying God's word for this competition. 3) Yes but I could only consider milkshape usable for me. Sorry that I don't know what other prices there could/should have been. 4) Maybe setup up a clock on some page for the next time to show when the competion ends. Edit; ------------------ [VoHW] (Help needed) [Blog] - Truedisciple (mp3) [This message has been edited by jari (edited September 20, 2006).] |
|
steveth45 Member Posts: 536 From: Eugene, OR, USA Registered: 08-10-2005 |
quote: The idea of winning is one of the main drives in competing in any competition. It's normal and healthy to try to win. "Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may win." I Cor. 9:24 ------------------ |
luke Member Posts: 311 From: I use your computer as my second Linux box Registered: 10-30-2005 |
1) I must admit, the contest starting just as school started didn't work out for me, but otherwise I would say 2-3 weeks (at a 'good' time lol ) would float my boat 2) I didn't really like the ragnorok theme, mostly since It doesn't really have that much to make a game (eg, you have to lose, since the world gets destroyed =D) 3) I think we had enough prizes 4) Um... I think thats it ------------------ |
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
1. 2 weeks was fine for a speedgame, but during school was just too hard. life was a mess. I was completely exhausted at the end of last week. 2. I liked the theme. large enough to have diversity, but small enough to not be meaningless. 3. the prize list was well endowed, shall I say. very generous of the sponsors. it just makes me sad that I won't win won. 4. I agree with steveth. having prizes set ahead of time for the categories would be good, maybe one unassigned prize for a winner who did an outstanding job in that category and maybe an all-over winner, too. after all, a game isn't seperate categories, but a single entity. and they'res nothing wrong with crushing your competition, it's just rather hard to do it. ------------------ |
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
ragnarok theme? what are you talking about Luke? lol... the theme was revelation. yeah, the school thing was the problem for me. if it was during the summer, 2 weeks is the perfect amount. I liked the theme. I would like to see a theme of the book of philemon, one of my favorite games EVER was a game where you play as philemon and you have to escape and then travel and find Paul in prison and meet him. and you like get saved along the way. it was so cool. it was really old, (it only ran in DOS mode, you know how on the old windows PCs they had dos mode..) but it was a really cool game. I would like a theme like that. the prizes were great. Milkshape. What else can I say? Eternal Wars was there too, wasn't it? Make more categories which you can win. maybe make 2nd and 3rd place winners. give them some 20 dollar software if they get 2nd-3rd. lol. ------------------ |
SSquared Member Posts: 654 From: Pacific Northwest Registered: 03-22-2005 |
1) Two weeks was just right. I've given my reasons elsewhere, but I felt 2 weeks pushed me just right the whole time. 1 week would have gotten next to nothing decent. 3 weeks would not have pushed me enough and I may have found myself scrambing the last 3 or 4 days realizing I had next to nothing complete. I have a wife and two young kids, so I could not start working until about 9 PM each night. The 2nd week I found myself working until 12:30 or 1:00 AM each night. Tiring, but the 2 week time limit made it an exciting time each night with my Friday night going until nearly 3 AM. I just really enjoyed the 2 week timeframe. 2) The theme seemed just as good as any other theme. I thought there is quite a lot you can do with Revelation. 3) Plenty. Very generous. Perhaps more in the way of traditional language (C++, C#, Java) plug-ins or something. Even better, some good/decent books on game development, 3D modeling, game design, etc. 4) Perhaps not having it during a 3-day holiday weekend. |
|
luke Member Posts: 311 From: I use your computer as my second Linux box Registered: 10-30-2005 |
for your information, ragnorok is the norse 'end of the world' I just like the sound of it... ragnorok... lol ------------------ |
TwoBrothersSoftware Member Posts: 141 From: Janesville, Wi USA` Registered: 08-05-2006 |
The amount of time, - was fine Prizes - not that many that I would use, my brother likes the games - I think FPS creator would be interesting to look at, as would GL basic, and Milkshape. I would not post the theme until it starts (which solves any can we code yet questions), and a count down timer was already suggested but I second that. |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
see, the problem with philemon, is that you have all games after the story of a slave running from his master. fine for one game, but too narrow for a competition. runner ups, however, would be a cool slot. get like a small prize.a booster pack of redemption cards or you know, something bigger. or not.
------------------ |
|
Jari Member Posts: 1471 From: Helsinki, Finland Registered: 03-11-2005 |
quote: Well I can participate in a competition without the desire to win like this one just because of the theme, it was my main motivation in the end when I thought that I probably wont won. And what meant by "got in head" was obsession to win. Which isn't good as it can mess up your priorities in life and in what comes to God's will. ------------------ [VoHW] (Help needed) [Blog] - Truedisciple (mp3) |
Gamer4Christ Member Posts: 551 From: Kokomo, Indiana, USA Registered: 07-19-2005 |
1. Timing was an issue for me. I am going to work for a good period of my day, coming home exhausted. I have schoolwork to finish, or school to go to requiring my evenings. Then on top of that I have a fiance to spend time with, because she insists I do, j/k DR, I happily sacrifice my much needed free-time! =D  lol... anyway On a serious note... I am taking next semester off of school, mostly because of the stresses of planning a wedding, and my life completely changing, but making a game could be a good stress relief, so if you do another one anytime soon could you start it maybe earlier January or February? I should be able to participate in that one, lol.2. The theme was a little questionable, because I know that the book of Revelation is one of the most disagreeable books in the Bible. I mean people disagree over it, not that the Bible disagrees with it, lol. So I would almost pick a more vague, or at least a less argued subject, like creation (And not how many days/years it took to do so)... you know, lol. But I had a plan and a story for it, so it was no big deal for me, lol. 3. Prizes seemed fine, lol, I mean there were five categories and what ten prizes? that seems enough for me, lol. 4. Improvements, lol, plan the comp around school, I mean maybe during Winter Break, or Summer Break, or something, lol... but definitely do it when school will not be an issue for at least the Elementary - High School students. Other then that, lol, no comments. ------------------ |
|
Jari Member Posts: 1471 From: Helsinki, Finland Registered: 03-11-2005 |
quote: But is that the right way to go, avoiding God's word because of our lack of uderstanding? I think we shouldn't give that to Satan because there is no need to jump in to a thelogical debates when we can preach the word, knowing that we wont be ashamed at the last day when Jesus comes. Personally I simply believe that God created world in literally in six days because He says so and because I know that God could have created world in six nano seconds if He wanted to. And I am too sick of scientists and their theories (which will always remain as therories) to study about this. ------------------ [VoHW] (Help needed) [Blog] - Truedisciple (mp3) |
kenman Member Posts: 518 From: Janesville WI Registered: 08-31-2006 |
I think it would have been better had the topic been on the book of Jude. Next time, I might take a different approach and write a program for the competition instead of doing the team thing, but the team thing was okay too! |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
how can we make a game on the book of Jude? I was thinking more book of Judges. ------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
ooo.... judges. now *that* would be a great theme. ------------------ |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
I call Ehud ------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
wha? oh you mean the guy that built the double-edged knife and stabbed that king guy? man... i wanted to do that... ------------------ [This message has been edited by buddboy (edited September 21, 2006).] |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
Oh come on, there are plenty of heroes in Judges, you got Gideon and Samson right there, lol. I mean Gideon's story would make one awesome RTS. ------------------ [This message has been edited by Lava (edited September 21, 2006).] |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
Samson would make a great tetris clone. ... just give me a sec to work that one out ------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
ROFL!!! how? Gideon... that would make an awesome game. I still wanted to do Ehud... lol.;.. ------------------ |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
actually. sadly, I got one. you gotta stack up the philistines in the well, and if they overflow, your philistine wife will find out and start nagging. ------------------ |
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
Lol, Arch  I would love to play your Samson Tetris.  Although I doubt Microsoft would add it to their Entertainment Pack... Lazarus |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
with little screams when the blocks fall into place, who can afford not to? ------------------ |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
Is there water in the well? |
|
kenman Member Posts: 518 From: Janesville WI Registered: 08-31-2006 |
Everyones interest seems to be pretty keen  on what should be the theme of the next contest. The last contest I entered made a list of possible themes, then one week before the comp started, everyone chose their top 5 and ranked 1,2,3,4,5. Each of the entered comptetitors then chose their theme secretly. This way, even though the theme was kept confidential until the actual start of the comp, everyone knew what choices they had so they could start getting ideas together in their minds. Do we have to wait a year? Next time I will be submitting an entry even if it is the cheesiest thing in the state of Wisconsin! |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
i mean, heck, we can always start our own one. it won't be an official CCN, nor can you guarantee prizes. ------------------ |
|
Matt Langley Member Posts: 247 From: Eugene, OR, USA Registered: 08-31-2006 |
I came into this community a little too late, so didn't get a chance to actually compete, though observed a bit and can give feedback as well -- 1. Did you think 2 weeks was enough, too long or too short? -- In the GarageGames community a very active community members holds a "GID" event, representing Game In a Day. So I think 2 weeks is more than enough time to get a prototype up. In fact, if anything it can helping teach people new to game dev to really just focus on a prototype to ensure your game concept is fun and effective before investing mass ammounts of time.
Revelation seems like a great theme... in fact for games it allows a lot of diversity some other Christian themes might not be so forgiving in.
The prizes seemed good, maybe a bit more and a bit diverse (maybe not just The Game Creators licenses, maybe Blitz, and well I'm a bit biased towards Torque myself). Though can understand how this might be out of your hands.
Support an environment where people can talk as they progress and post pictures while they progress as well. The greatest things about these type of competitions is feeding of eachothers drive and motivation. Also I may be able to work out some GarageGames licenses as rewards for some competitions like this, drop me an e-mail and I'll see what I can do (no promises). ------------------ |
|
SSquared Member Posts: 654 From: Pacific Northwest Registered: 03-22-2005 |
Wow...I'm looking forward to next year's prizes already. Hmmm, this is how rumors get started, eh? Matt, regarding #4, I actually felt we had some great discussions. A HUGE part of my enjoyment was exactly what you stated: "feeding off each other's drive and motivation." As time drew close, people started showing screenshots and describing their progress. When I felt I would have no actual game, I was encouraged and continued to persevere. When I actually had a limping computer AI, I was ecstatic! It was really neat to hear everyone finishing things up on the last few days. You are right on with the timeframe. I think just about everyone (if not all) started out with a much more aggressive idea and concept and soon realized the need to back off and scale things down. Hopefully we'll be more prepared the next go around. |
|
Matt Langley Member Posts: 247 From: Eugene, OR, USA Registered: 08-31-2006 |
@ssquared: Just wanted to clarify more, I left my #4 comment much more open than I did in my mind, lol guess thats what I get for posting when my mind feels like sludge. I read through many of the comments and discusions (and screenshots) and definately thought there were some great conversations and motivation going on. If anything I was just wanted to re-enforce that and suggest maybe supporting and facilitating it even more ------------------ |
|
SSquared Member Posts: 654 From: Pacific Northwest Registered: 03-22-2005 |
Funny you should write that, as I sort of left off something from my message. I meant to ask you what we can do better next time around in regards to what you mentioned. I thought maybe you didn't like it being all bunched up in a single loooooong thread. Perhaps you have some better idea of how to bring it all together. |
CPUFreak91 Member Posts: 2337 From: Registered: 02-01-2005 |
quote: Two weeks was perfect for the Revelation game genre. The theme was very good. Future themes could be evangelization, persecution, visions, dreams, or missions (such as missionary missions). I believe there were plenty of prizes. I would like to see gift certificates (Amazon, Thinkgeek, some-christian-apparell/book shop). Or computer hardware prizes for Desktops and laptops (decorations, hard drives, WAN cards, etc). I can't think of anything that should be changed, other than a website with registration forms, history of winners from past competitions and links to hosted games from past competitions. Keep the games OSS. ------------------ |
bennythebear Member Posts: 1225 From: kentucky,usa Registered: 12-13-2003 |
[QUOTE]Originally posted by D-SIPL: though i wasn't in this competition i'll give my input, i plan on being in the next one(i'll should actually have some skills by then) 1. i think 2 weeks is enough time, because it's a SPEED competition. the contest isn't about making full 3-d games with 100+ hours of gameplay. 2. the revelation theme was pretty good, but i'd like to see something from the old testament, or something based on something Jesus said. for example, you could make a game that taught loving your neighbor as yourself or something in that order. 3. there was enough prizes i think. but something i would like to see is maybe a few books(1 per category/aka 1 per winner) on game development. it could be a book on direct x, open gl, game ai, anything that would help somewhat new developers better their knowledge/skills. 4. ....i retract my statement...i totally misread the rule about operating systems...i so could've made some cheezy game for this competition...but do to me thinkin' it said something like "the game must run on the following operating systems..." instead of "the game must run on ONE of the following operating systmes..." i didn't think i could make anything since vb express if all i have/know right now...major bummer... anywho...that's my two cents. can't wait to see who the winners were. edit - 4. proverbs 25:7 www.gfa.org - Gospel for Asia www.persecution.com - Voice of the Martyrs [This message has been edited by bennythebear (edited September 29, 2006).] |
Cohort X Member Posts: 126 From: The Great Pacific Northwest Registered: 09-16-2006 |
quote: It wasn't required to be cross platform. You could make it on whatever platform you chose. quote: I thought it was a good length. Maybe not starting the competition during a holiday weekend right before much of the coders have to go back to school for the year would be a good idea. quote: I thought revelations was a difficult subject to make a quick game about. That book is epic spanning thousands of years and dealing with the entire population of the physical and spiritual realm battling to survive. It's hard to think of a fun quick game that can deal with all of that. quote: I thought there were enough prizes, but plugins for applications that contestants may or may not have didn't seem like a good prize. Maybe do gift certificates. quote: maybe have the judging time be shorter than the competition?  (just kidding)[This message has been edited by Cohort X (edited September 28, 2006).] |
|
kenman Member Posts: 518 From: Janesville WI Registered: 08-31-2006 |
quote: Couldn't agree more, developing a mild case of peptic ulcer disease and hyperphlegmulosis worring about the results! [This message has been edited by kenman (edited September 29, 2006).] |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
Must be a really rare disease Kenman, it's not in the dictionary But why are we getting all impatient about it when everyone knows Arch won? Lazarus |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
because, yeah, you know, how expansive my game is. I'm really proud of it's open-ended-ness. ------------------ |
|
kenman Member Posts: 518 From: Janesville WI Registered: 08-31-2006 |
quote: Peptic ulcer disease not in your dictionary? (It meens guts a hurtin' in playn englush!) quote: I am just curious to see what the judges have to say. I do, deep in my heart, just as everyone else does know, that Arch won, with his ever expansive open ended game! [This message has been edited by kenman (edited September 29, 2006).] |
|
SSquared Member Posts: 654 From: Pacific Northwest Registered: 03-22-2005 |
Wasn't Arch's an angel flight simulator? Worked great for me! I flew through those white clouds for hours. |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
You can't get much more expansive or open ended than that! Yeah, the angel animation was really cool. Loved it, Arch! *thumbsup* Lazarus |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
quote: Ok, here's my full opinion, now that the comp is officially over. I believe the judging system was severely flawed. In getting rid of the art category I felt I mised any chance of winning. When I first entered the competition, I knew there I would be inferior to other people of the competition. In Christian teaching, I wasn't as good as alot of the "scripture miners" around here. I wasn't a big coding king, so I knew stability I would miss. Funnest game, that is so subjective I didn't even bother. Original concept, I didn't really have the knack to aim for that. I am an artist, so art is where I felt I could really apply and win one of the cateogries. So I went and I compromised many gameplay ideas me and Crazy had because of the graphics and time. Then the results came in. But I didn't lose to other graphic games, in fact I couldn't win. So in the end all I had was (I felt), a visually polished game, but nothing much else behind the pretty face. Personally I would rather lose to someone than not have any chance of winning anything. And this could go for any of the categories, what if everyone had a different opinion about Christian teaching or stabilty? In the next competiion, unless the judging system is fixed, I might not enter to win. If I am going get stessed over 2 weeks to try and deliver a good display of graphics only to have it not be of any importance. Or to aim for something else, like original concept, and have the chance of all of the judges voting differently. ------------------ [This message has been edited by LAVA (edited October 15, 2006).] |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
well, Ereon probably would have won the graphics section i think. his screenshots looked pretty cool. ------------------ | |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
quote: I don't care who *would've* won. But when you totally get rid of the category, I have no chance at all. ------------------ |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
good point. i think there should have been some sort of revote or a tie-breaker person. like if theres a tie the tiebreaker gets to decide who to go with. or just have the people revote. ------------------ | |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
they could have asked some other guy to be a judge and decide, but it's probably hard to find someone with enough time. |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
lol we're all posting within moments of each other. ------------------ | |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
OFF TOPIC! MODS, BAN HIM!!!! But yeah, I think something like that would've been much better than just dropping the category. |
|
buddboy Member Posts: 2220 From: New Albany, Indiana, U.S. Registered: 10-08-2004 |
lol if people got banned for that we would have like, 5-6 people on here... ------------------ | |
|
Lazarus Member Posts: 1668 From: USA Registered: 06-06-2006 |
4. Krylar, Klumsy, Mack and D-SIPL. And I'm not even sure about those last two. Lazarus |
|
steveth45 Member Posts: 536 From: Eugene, OR, USA Registered: 08-10-2005 |
quote: The category didn't receive a prize because the votes were all split up. You had just as much of a chance to win it as anyone else. ------------------ |
|
Lava Member Posts: 1905 From: Registered: 01-26-2005 |
quote: Not if you compromise gameplay to get better graphics. If I lost to best graphics it wouldnt be a big deal to me. When I was going to read the results I didn't get my hopes up. I would just try to do better graphics next time. ------------------ [This message has been edited by LAVA (edited October 15, 2006).] |
|
ArchAngel Member Posts: 3450 From: SV, CA, USA Registered: 01-29-2002 |
Lava, atleast you got a vote. I spent the majority of my project working on my animations. I ended up sacrificing the entire game for the graphics. bad decision on my part, but c'est la vie. although, I do agree. a category shouldn't be dropped. ------------------ |
dXter Member Posts: 59 From: Texas, the US of A Registered: 09-26-2006 |
I wasn't even in this competition, and maybe someone already said this, but maybe instead of having a speedgame competition you could put a longer deadline period but give extra points to the games that are entered sooner, that way people could either aim for the speed points or make bigger games and go for the quality points. ------------------ "Time is an excellent teacher, but eventually it kills all of its students." |
|
TwoBrothersSoftware Member Posts: 141 From: Janesville, Wi USA` Registered: 08-05-2006 |
Does anyone know if there was a specific branch of Open Source licensing that was agreed to. |
|
D-SIPL Moderator Posts: 1345 From: Maesteg, Wales Registered: 07-21-2001 |
quote: GPL i believe. I will check. The prizes will be on their way shortly. I emailed the sponsors today with your email addresses. Thanks for making it a great competition. I'm looking forward to next years. ------------------ |
